I sell quite a few roses at my nursery, and I have in recent years started promoting some of the Radler roses and Easy Elegance roses from Bailey Nurseries over the possibly hardier but less disease resistant Morden roses that exploded in popularity 10-15 years ago.
My line has been, “as long as you plant them very deep they will come back without protection. They’ll function as a crown-hardy perennial, dying to the ground each year but coming back strong.”
This winter, while lacking in extended periods of severe cold, was one of very little snow cover. An open winter. Also we had a very warm spell in December when things were melting. One customer told me some of their plants started to swell their buds in December.
For either of those reasons, it was a brutal winter on roses, Hydrangea arborescens, and some perennials. In other words, a good test winter.d
It was actually an easier winter than the previous one for apple trees and cane hardy roses such as R. virginiana, because of the lack of severe cold. But for what I have been calling the modern die-back rose it was a real trial. Here are some quick, informal observations, subject to error and revision:
High Voltage: Quite a few stone dead. No signs of life on any.
Candy Oh: One of about ten showing signs of life.
Paprika: dead.
White Out: mostly alive.
Rainbow Knock Out: mostly alive
Petit Pink: generally dead
Kashmir: two of two alive.
Pinktopia: two of four showing signs of life
All the Rage: dead
Little Mischief: dead
Sunshine Daydream: dead
Sunrise Sunset: about 20 percent showing signs of life
Double KO: over 50% alive
Cancan: generally pretty strong shoots from the base
Morning Magic: generally alive
Prairie Joy: generally alive
Brite Eyes: I think almost 50% living
Commander Gillette/Basye’s Legacy: Plenty of live wood
Darlow’s Enigma: no sign of life (one plant)
Music Box: a tiny shoot on one of three plants
Champagne Wishes: dead
Sunny KO: two of three showing sprouts
Small R. xanthina seedlings: 10 to 60% live wood
It is still possible that some of the ones I have labeled as dead will send up shoots from below the ground, but hope is fading week by week.
So all in all a great test winter. I had lined out a lot of small seedlings last July, and many of them are now dead. It is great to be able to learn something about those that remain.
Hi Joe,
Thanks for this posting. I’m experiencing some strange and unexpected results this spring.
Last fall I felt I was making some serious success towards creating some yellow roses for my area zone 3.
This spring after a mild winter with very little snow cover, I’m seeing lots of dead seedling from what I laid
out last fall.
These seedling were planted out in last August, early September, I wonder how the results would have been
if I had got there plants in the ground in June when I was planting the vegetable garden.
I do believe getting the seedlings in early can mitigate winter damage in newly planted seedlings.
I would love to hear other opinions in these points
Here in central NJ we had long lasting Arctic blasts over a 3 month period, and some snow.
My roses are planted with crowns 3-4 inches below soil level.
I lost 2 Floribundas that had been strong performers up to now: Monkey Business and Julia Child. However, 2 other Floribundas… Moondance and Honey Perfume, came through very well.
I also lost the Hybrid Tea Lady Bird.
Chuck, I thought I was late getting mine in in July. If you’re in Zone 3 I do think it would be better to plant them out in June. It would probably also be a good idea to plant them down in a little trench that could be filled in as they grow throughout the summer so that their crowns end up somewhat below the soil level.
My experience this spring is the same as yours. It wasn’t a brutally cold winter but we never had more than 6” or 8” of snow at any time. So there wasn’t much cover when the coldest temps came. The early cold snap in November probably took its toll on the roses as well.
My garden roses were particularly hit hard. At least eight have died: Secret, Secret’s Out, Raspberry Kiss, Belinda’s Dream, Kashmir, Keith’s Delight, Robin Hood and Centennial Rose. The first three were planted last year so this was their first winter. Belinda’s Dream, Kashmir and Keith’s Delight are two to four years old and have died back to the crown every year but always came back. But the last two I’ve had for close to ten years and usually survived well. Even roses that are still alive there is less live wood and fewer new shoots. My High Voltage and Fiesta both only have one or two shoots. Even the more reliable OGR roses Maidens Blush and Tuscany Superb aren’t showing much signs of life yet, but I’m not writing them off just yet.
It’s must be a good sign when almost all of my 2nd and 3rd year seedlings came thru with flying colors, I only lost 2 or 3 out of 180 plants. Some of them have flower buds on them already, that must mean I’m making progress.
I, too, have taken this occasion to feel proud of some of my seedlings. I have one rose in particular, of which I have lost the parentage, that appears to be a full rebloomer that also survived nearly to the tips. I’m also kind of happy that many of my seedlings that were the result of indulgent, iffy crosses have been culled.
Crazy easy winter here - left end of February - had leafing occurring mid April - even the Geschwind look alive, … Eos looks like all the cane survived, again Gertrude Jekyll shines with shoots coming out of cane 18 inches above ground … must succeed in crossing this one day.But all the hardy grapes dead, pulled those today, strange mind you since the “hardy” wisteria" looks alive with a green shoot.
Nearly finished the spring plant with repeats of metis, minette, doorenbos, Claire lebarge (sic), 1/2 dozen Dr. Merkeley (you really need to plant this one) going in as a hedging project … and more Geschwinds repeats going in. Norlander did the best of last years plant.
El Ariana seems to have done well under the protection. Lillian’s not covered did well but ones I bent down and covered a disaster … last time I protect them
Joe,
You still have to do a few of the indulgent iffy crosses every year, sometimes they turn out better than you expected even if most don’t pan out.
I’m glad the full reblooming seedling survived so well this winter, it’s always encouraging to see one of your plants do so well. I have several Carefree Sunshine crosses that are surprisingly hardy, repeat well and have good disease resistance, that I’d like to do a few crosses with this year if I have time. But I’m in the middle of moving so I don’t know if I’ll have time for any crosses this year.
I’ve lost very few seedlings from winter kill over the years even when the temps were 15 to 20 degrees colder than this past winter, but then there usually is good snow cover to protect them. I don’t know if the lack of snow is what made this year different. The winter of 2011-2012 was mild with little snow like this past winter also but I don’t remember losing so many plants to winter kill that year. It could have been the early cold snap in November or the warm up in December this time that did them in.
Thanks for posting your list. I feel for you. I went through the same thing this late winter and lost my four best roses. I’ve had to rethink my breeding goals and how I handle protecting seedlings for the winter. I guess I should think of the process as winter culling.
That’s too bad Rob. To lose your best roses has to be frustrating.
I don’t protect my roses as well as I used to. I’ve gotten lazy and I do see more dieback than before. I leave my most tender roses in pots so I can bury them for the winter and sometimes even that isn’t enough. The ones I buried this past winter came thru with little dieback at all. I had intended to pot up the Hybrid Teas that I got last year but they were so large that I didn’t have pots big enough so I planted them in the ground instead and they didn’t survive the winter.
We had a relatively mild winter, never below 5 F. But the sudden plunge in late Nov killed off a lot of potted roses that were just sitting there waiting to get put away. Most every yellow rose I’d purchased own-root from the west coast over the years went away. A few bushes I was sure are tender I had put into storage a few days before the big freeze. They made it OK.
A couple hundred plunged pots that didn’t get more than a few leaves as cover made it OK by and large. Some had no dieback. Bullseye did very well, Eyeconic Lemonade barely survived, 1st Impression is gone. The Carefree Sunshine and Sunny KO were fine. Yellow Brick Road expired but Music Box, Brite Eyes and High voltage which had been planted into ground the previous spring did fine, losing scarcely any wood. Rainbow KO on campus had blooms this year at the same time as Austrian Copper, from buds that must have been formed last fall. They showed up right next to dead hips/ flowers from the previous season. Same goes for KO and dbl KO. Even 6 ft tall Carefree sunshine along our main avenue looked good until pruned when they were breaking forth. So we know that 0 or below is the break point for a bunch of roses and that they aren’t likely to make it every year at -25 or so.
Joe, I’m curious whether Arctic Sunrise made it. I don’t expect it to be hardier than Carefree Beauty, but I don’t know how Golden Arctic acts as a hardiness donor.
My environment and breeding goals (strengh and desease resistance are first two, cold res cannot be tested) are quite different but…
I am frustrated when everything is going well and my environment not selective.
So much I grow some susceptible vars as a test and a source of contamination.
And happy when nature does the culling as further work may show progress.
The benefits of a great deal of experience, Pierre. For most of us, we have a lot hanging on the few good roses we have created. I’m sure, with several thousand crosses under ones belt, it affords a lot better perspective, and you are right to be philosophical.
But as for me, I will always maintain that the ones I lost would have been the most incredible plants anyone ever laid eyes upon.
It’s a very frustrating thing to believe in the potential of a plant, and never have the opportunity to confirm or refute it. And as you indicate, cold-hardiness is not a thing of importance for a good many rosarians, so it’s a shame to lose an otherwise good rose to the cold. If it were disease, then it was likely a rose that warranted culling. A freakish winter doing in an otherwise good plant however must be frustrating.
Oso Happy Smoothie appears to have come through better than Oso Happy Candy Oh and Oso Easy Paprika. I have a row of about six plants each, and at least five of six Smoothie are coming while all of the others appear to have died.
Larry’s roses: Arctic Sunrise is coming well from ground level. (I haven’t checked on Carefree Beauty in another location.) “LVP” has died. Silver Something is alive, and two Orange Surprise are alive right next to one dead Oso Easy Paprika and two dead Oso Easy Lemon Zest.
(It was a somewhat freakish winter and we can’t necessarily extrapolate these results into a final evaluation of the roses’ hardiness.)
About a dozen High Voltage in a row, stone dead.
My First Impression x R. virginiana are generally coming vigorously from near ground level.
Jackie’s Foliolosa x Henry Hudson seedlings are alive to the tips.
I’m beginning to see signs of life from Belinda’s Dream, Centennial Rose, Sheila’s Perfume and Secrets Out. At least I hope the shoots belong to them and not the root stock.
My Smoothie, Candy Oh and Paprika have survived with Paprika with the most dieback. Which surprises me because several years ago it had no dieback and was budding out before the snow had melted around it, but it had 2’ of snow on it that year.
Thanks Joe. Little Yellow Beauty (your LVP) is basically RiseN Shine OP I’ve concluded. Silver Sunrise is New Dawn x Rise N Shine. Arctic Sunrise is CB x Golden Arctic which is purportedly sub-sero but not a clear pedigree so far as hardiness goes. It goes by the # 84 from Brownell. # 124 from which I have seedlings out of OP seeds from Andy Vanable is also Brownell. Many of the #124 seedlings are good below 0 F, some are not. So I probably don’t have anything reliably hardy much below 0 F. The survival of OrSup confirms to me that it is indeed a seedling of Carefree Copper, showing its foetida genes.
With luck I’ll get something related to Lillian Gibson or Haidee one of these days, or even RSMT5.
FWIW I have hips set on Therese Bugnet using R pomifera pollen this year. Did it mostly just as a thing to try. No idea where it could lead.
I’ve had to rethink my breeding goals and how I handle protecting seedlings for the winter. I guess I should think of the process as winter culling.