Using Soleil d'Or

Soleil d’Or is the first rose to bring yellow into almost all present day roses. But with that, it brought susceptibility to black spot.

But I think we could use it today to create modern day Pernetiana-like roses but without the black spot.

I think this would be interesting because, as much as I like orange roses of today such as Livin

In so doing, you will no doubt improve the shrub form. You are in the right climate to work with it. The bloom & the scent is exquisite. The rest needs work.

I have worked with ‘Soleil d’Or’ for two years and the results have been uniformly dreadful. The plants are ugly and ungainly, both Mildew and Blackspot prone and many of them bloom sparsely at best, Very, VERY few of them have any yellow or orange coloring. My suggestion: run away!



Which parents have you used?

Well… right now, I’ve done a few crosses using it’s pollen on Queen Elizabeth, Pacific Serenade, and Aloha.

Tomorrow I was going to pollinate Golden Angel and possibly Tamora. (Tamora for me has never germinated… but I still try.)

Well, I guess I will keep my plant for it’s historic value. It’s not a bad plant for me. It’s actually quite clean, and the flowers are unmatched in my opinion…


I’ll give it a shot for this season at least, now that I’ve already pollinated some roses.

Nonetheless, I would like to hear some of your crosses…

I’ve put its pollen on anything that would take it: Abraham Darby, Golden Angel, Joycie…anything with yellow or orange coloring. The results were uniformly dreadful. Never again. Its trying to reinvent the wheel, and we are many, many generations past that now.

The closer to a hybrid perpetual a rose is, the less I desire anything about it. HP’s are almost everything I dislike about roses rolled into one. Soleil d’Or combines that with foetida, which is just asking for trouble.

Almost three years on, does anyone have further thoughts or experiences on Soleil d’Or?

In a word, dont!

Thanks, Paul! Can I quote you on that? ;-D

Has Gottfried Keller ever been used to bring yellow into modern roses?

The Canadian rose J.P. Connell has Gottfried Keller in it several generations back.

I still would not use it. Youre not going to get what you want, especially at the saturation or health desired. There are way better roses out there for that. Like I have said before, the only thing Rosa foetida offers over its Pernetian and modern counterparts is increased cold hardiness, but that comes with some nasty prices or very high gambles.

I will friendly challenge your opinions Mike.

Here french Riviera with conditions that favor alternatively all and every rose deseases to the point that only a very few HTs Fls do survive; here foetida and Soleil d’Or are tough durable plants with a good spring flowering.

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So you suggest using it there? Or … ?

Why not? I do a little.

Some complements may give better results i.e.the pimpinellifoliae.

Or going beyond F1 other smaller leaflets species.

Some time ago it was considered here that for these species part of desease resistance could be linked to leaflet size.

Its all about location, as usual. Here in the PNW I can NOT imagine a more sickly plant than ‘Soleil d’Or’. Even when sprayed regularly, it still suffers badly from Blackspot. Its the only rose I grow that succumbs to disease even when sprayed.

Yeah, it and its closest kin, like I have stated before, basically “melt” in slow motion in front of your very eyes. Its rather disturbing.

The Scotch Briars are not too much better here. I iintentfully avoid them and anything they are closely related to.

Maybe more will be known about rose fungal disease in a more global way (both geographically and holistically). Until then, I am still not touching either although I would use, and did try using, Carefree Copper. If whatever it is that makes foetida and its kin a sin here can be remedied then I’d give their usage a 2nd thought.

HMF frontpage for Soleil d’Or quotes that “Soleil d’Or is grown in Zone 3 Alberta, Canada where it survives with no winter protection other than snow cover.” Any idea where this comment originates? I have never seen Soleil d’Or in Finland but it would be interesting to test how it does in our dry and cold climate, where blackspot is a minor problem. Persiana get very little blackspot in my garden in southern Finland, less than for example the Canadian rose John Davis.

Helsinki, Finland

I’m not able to determine who provided the Alberta Z. 3 comment. Perhaps Margit Schowalter either provided it or might be able to provide more information? She’s in Alberta.

I would guess the comment came from Paul Olsen. I am not acquainted with anyone growing it in Alberta.