When Star Magic got ten by ten here, and about four to five feet high, it had flowers on it all the time. Didn’t matter what time of year nor what the weather was like. It just BLOOMED. That’s also the one which created the seedling I hope to name for my youngest nephew. Cross it with Orangeade and it looses its prickles and blooms all the time.
When Star Magic got ten by ten here, and about four to five feet high, it had flowers on it all the time. Didn’t matter what time of year nor what the weather was like. It just BLOOMED. That’s also the one which created the seedling I hope to name for my youngest nephew. Cross it with Orangeade and it looses its prickles and blooms all the time.
Mine is over 10 years old now and largely unpruned. It still doesn’t blossom all that much. It is fertile. It creates a variety of seedling types. Some show almost no influence and others show significant influence.
As one might expect some do not repeat.
See link for one of the best. It is also fertile.
I’d try out PPD, Robert.
OK Jadae. I’ll try to get one propagated for you.
Does anyone know the source of Moore’s soulieana?
I’m curious to know if it’s the same clone utilized by Carruth?
Thanks, Robert
I have it Robert, but I have no idea what its provenance is.
Theyre different hybrids, Robert. Moore used Anytime, while Weeks used a mix of Zorina, Europeana and Sunsprite.
Zorina and Sunsprite would probably explain the blends, yellows and ease of mix into the mauve range.
I wish both parties had used more modern, healthier versions of what they did, but I think the outcomes of both parties’ work are spectacular.
Hi Jadae, yes, I know they are different.
I’m curious to know if Moore’s soulieana came from Carruth.
Soulieana species has variants. It would be nice to know where the tendency for repeat comes from.
I seriously doubt if Ralph got his soulieana from Tom. Sequoia offered it for sale for at least the past 25 years.
It’s easy to look at what was done and wish for different sources. “Health” is a relative term. When Pernet was asked, “What about the black spot?” concerning his Pernetianas, his reported response was, “What black spot?” His climate didn’t promote black spot, so he never saw it. Ralph Moore created a semi striped, ruffled, large open bloom Rugosa shrub which he gave Tom Carruth for Week’s to test. Week’s rejected it due to rust. It also rusted in my Newhall garden. I asked Ralph about the rust and he honestly asked, “what rust?”. It grew in Visalia for many years before the weather was conducive to promote it to rust. When it did, it was AWFUL!
I asked Ralph years ago why he chose Angel Face as the lavender to use to intensify the “Halo” in his roses. Surely he could have used a better lavender? His exact quote was, “Because I HAD it”. It’s easy for us to “engineer” our crosses when we do a few hundred a year. Having seen what was done at Sequoia and imagining the intensity of the scope of an operation such as Week’s, I’m more than amazed things turn out as well as they do!
Hhhmm…, then I wonder if Carruth’s soulieana came from Moore?
There are only so many sources for such things. To be honest I don’t remember the soulieana at Sequoia.
It seems odd Mr. Moore waited so long to experiment with it and/or introduce things from those experiments.
Not really. Renae germinated in the late thirties, introduced 1954. You’ve seen his code numbers showing the first flowering of something twenty years before its first sale date. He juggled so many balls at once, and Soulieana wasn’t one of his priorities, just a side interest. You could write Tom to see where he got it. There were so many places for things to hide at that nursery, not being able to remember a particular plant there, among tens of thousands, isn’t surprising.
All true!
I’m not curious enough to bug Tom. I know his soulieana hybrid comes out of an old breeding program and that it was a fluke he managed to rescue it.
There’s an article about it in one of the ARS Annuals. I think it was 2008.
Ah, Sorry Robert. I thought you meant the hybrid of – not the species itself.
Speaking of soul, I always wondered if Chevy Chase was fertile enough to bother with. I think there is one at Heirlooms. I like the lineage, for what its worth.
Kim, sadly there really isn’t much in the lavender world to compete with Angel Face. There are a few newer ones as of late, but they’re often toned with purple and related to Big Purple. I have had luck with Royal Amethyst and Shocking Blue, but they have major issues, too. It is definitely a color class that needs improving on.
That is unfortunate. I often wondered if the Halos might have been better had he used bad old Sterling Silver instead of Angel Farce. Though is hasn’t AF’s fragrance, Ripples performs better here in SoCal, even with the mildew. It’s a prettier shade of lavender, too, but Ralph didn’t have it. Seven Seas is quite nice here. I have his Peach Halo, a larger version of Halo Carol, 'Halo Karol' Rose, also from the same self of (Anytime X Angel Face). Terrible plant but created as a breeder to get where he wanted to go. Talk about making the blind man deaf!
I’m working on mauves. There’s got to be a better one in the works somewhere.
Zary has been working on mauves. Most of his stuff seems to involve ‘Cotillion, not a favorite of mine. It’s mostly same ol’ same ol’ breeding lines.
Jade, ‘Chevy Chase’ looks like it has a lot of potential to me. I’m always suspicious when I see a cultivar this old with so few descendants. It could be that no one has picked it up to work with it but this seems unlikely. If you have access you might give it a go.
It’s classed, “Hybrid Multifora”. Weird!
Two things about ‘Chevy Chase’: mine has never set seed in 9 years, nor have I ever managed to find pollen. Secondly, do NOT buy one from Heirloom; thats where mine came from and I guarantee you mine was infected with RMV from the day I received it. Oh, and one other thing: it has very poor Blackspot resistance in my garden, even after 9 years. I expect it was classed as a Hybrid Multiflora because nobody at the ARS wanted to bother creating a Hybrid Soulieana class for ONE cultivar. Pffttt.
Michael, if you want to work with something from the R. soulieana group, I have the species here and can get you a rooted cane. I might also be able to arrange to send you pollen next Spring from Moore’s ‘Anytime’ X R. soulieana hybrid. The latter is responsible for breeding the charming ‘Baby Austin’, one of my favorite of Ralph’s late works. Although I have not attempted it before, I think ‘Baby Austin’ might be worth exploring as a breeder. It doesn’t set seed, so it would be as a pollen donor only.
I’ve often looked at J&P’s mauves and figured they came out of Heirloom, NOT one of my favorite mauves.
Most of the lavender/mauves are disasters, as far as vigor and fortitude are concerned. I too think ‘Angel Farce’ is a dreadful rose; it has no vigor and every specimen I have ever seen or grown myself has never exceeded 20", has had the bare minimum of foliage to support it and has suffered terribly from disease. Not exactly something I would willingly include in a breeding program these days. ‘Seven Seas’ is a much better plant in ever way, except fragrance.
I understand using the only thing available to get what you want, and I am as pragmatic as anyone (perhaps, more than some), but I took much time doing all the research I could to find what I thought was the best choice to use as tools to get what I sought. I’ll stick with Lilac Charm and something newer like Neptune (which is awesome here). I know LC has issues, but it is glorious.