I love the single multiflora-type flowers but I hate how the stamens go black straight away. A few years ago multiflora was combined with ‘Temple Bells’ and it seems to have improved the longevity of the stamens to give a relatively good display for the life of the flower.
[attachment 1275 Templebellsxmultiflora5.jpg]
These flowers are a few days old now and the stamens still look ok without losing that multiflora look. Notice the flower in the bottom right has had all its stamens bitten off cleanly by insects. It almost looks like I’ve prepped it for pollination. Pity it doesn’t repeat. I’m just wondering if this was a fluke or if it’s something others have also found? Wich + multiflora seems to be a great combination anyway, but is the way to improve the shelf-life of the stamens of multiuflora to infuse wich into it?
I’d like to hear a lot more about this topic as I love single-flowered roses. Beautiful, long-lasting stamens are such a desirable trait. Also love to know about red/maroon filaments and if anybody is breeding specifically with a goal in mind of drop dead gorgeous stamens (?flowers with ‘Dainty Bess’ looking stamens).
I believe there were a few singles from the Bonica lineage also with red filaments, but Astronomia 'Astronomia' Rose is the only one i can think of offhand.
Not to thread-hijack, but any thoughts as to strong candidates for red stamens? I find those attractive.
I love the pinkish-orange stamens of ‘Grace Seward’ bred by Dee Bennett. Looking at the descendent report on HMF, I can see that it has not produced many offspring. I don’t know if it is because the rose is not good for breeding or because no one has really played with it.
The blooms and stamens seem to stay fresh longer than the other singles in my garden during my high summer temps.
Captain Thomas has red stamen. Crimson Glory and Captain Thomas created Sunny June which has red stamen in a single yellow. Crimson Glory intensified both the yellow petals and red stamen. I can’t believe it’s never been used to create further roses. Captain Thomas went on to create Golden Showers, an unfortunate name half a century after its introduction, but a very useful rose. It also has red stamen. Of course, there is also Golden Wings with orange-red ones.
Astronomia has lovely pink-red stamens. A gorgeous rose with lots of appeal. It did set quite a few hips this yr, bloomed continuously, and I will see if the seeds show me anything. When the sun is hot the stamens do not have a very long life.
Interesting topic. Has there been any comparative studies (formal or informal) as to into what characteristics might make stamens last longer? I would think characteristics such as thickness, length, color, and even ploidy might affect it. Not to mention environmental factors such as temperature and humidity. I have a lot of lovely single and semi-doubles that look good until the stamens get fried (usually in a short amount of time). It would be nice to figure out what stamen characteristics to combine in the next generation to try to mitigate the frying.
The wich. influence in ‘Dolomiti’ is clear and if like other recent Kordes releases you could probably expect ‘Immensee’ and/or ‘The Fairy’ to not be too far back as well.
I grow wichurana here as well and its stamens do seem to have the same staying power as the seedling above has and a couple of the other single wich.-nased roses here also don’t seem to have the same longevity so I have a feeling it was just a fluke.
The wich. influence in ‘Dolomiti’ is clear and if like other recent Kordes releases you could probably expect ‘Immensee’ and/or ‘The Fairy’ to not be too far back as well.
I grow wichurana here as well and its stamens do seem to have the same staying power as the seedling above has and a couple of the other single wich.-nased roses here also don’t seem to have the same longevity so I have a feeling it was just a fluke.[/quote] should read:
The wich. influence in ‘Dolomiti’ is clear of course but rather remote IMO as foliage is rather coriaceous and typical Floribunda and petals as all parts are thicker and larger than the species. And no luck here as among others both Kordes and Noak are long breeding for better flower attributes than F1 from wich. can.
In my experience a rose with stamens that demonstrate about the shortest longevity is ‘Ballerina.’ HMF lists its parentage as unknown. Is R. moschata partly to blame for that? Its been years since I’ve grown ‘Mozart’ or other HMsks of that type, but I seem to remember that its stamen shelf-life was also extremely limited. On the other had I grow ‘Erfurt’ and its stamen staying power is much more pronounced.
Some other roses with pink/red/maroon filaments include First Light, White Wings (which Kim correctly discovered does not have Dainty Bess as a first gen parent), Flamingo (the HRug and a seedling from White Wings), Isobel, Ralph Moore’s old mini Candleflame, Crazy Dottie, Flame of Love, Ellen Willmott, Bonnie Jean, Dogwood, Butterfly Wings, Kathleen Mills, and Sutton Place.
Simon, I think that R. wich played some role in the development of the early single HT’s. A 1903 Andorra Nurseries catalog referred to some of A. Dickson’s Irish singles as H Wich’s - Irish Beauty, Irish Modesty, and Irish Glory - all 1900 introductions. Perhaps some of their 30 year popularity was tied to stamen longevity.
I think you’re correct about stamen longevity playing a large role in the popularity of single flowers. Greensleeves, as Harkness noted, quickly looks like a dirty, green ashtray when its stamen turn black. It’s what motivated him to create Sheila MacQueen whose petals do a pretty good job of covering the stamen.
I don’t think there is much in Ballerina other than multiflora. Nothing about her speaks of any other influence to me. Erfurt is greatly removed from multiflora, so its dirty stamen have been replaced with more durable ones from the other parents. The farther you get from multiflora, the better the flower quality and longer lasting the stamen. In my experience, moschata types have good stamen longevity. Significantly better than multiflora.
A few years back I bred Arahan ( Charles Austin X Unk HT) Semi double with great stamen presentation. These stay fresh looking untill the petals are about to drop and by that time go dark brown.
[attachment 1288 Arahan.jpg] Arahan, theses big stamens are passed down to its offspring and behave similary to the seed parent, Arahan’s offspring Natural Blonde displays quite large and long lived stamens.
[attachment 1289 NATURALBLONDE1.jpg]
[attachment 1290 Cholan3.jpg] Cholan is another which I bred displaying great stamen longivity and formation.
Some times blooms of simple form and beauty can greatly out weigh those which have great numbers of petals.
I love them. My Hot Salsa! (Louise Estes x Marilyn Monroe) has deep coral pink blooms, orange filaments and red stigmas. She’s won “Best Fully Open” hybrid tea and best seedling in a few rose shows. Also intense burgundy new foliage. It’s quite a striking display. If only she didn’t close up in the morning when it’s cold at the shows, lol!
I’d love to use Betty Boop but her stamens blow so quickly you hardly ever get to see them fresh unless you peek in a partially opened bloom.
One nice thing about many singles is I’ve noticed they tend to do well in hot climates.