Rugosas - Why the lack of breeding activity?

Over here in Europe, most roses are sold grafted onto “laxa” rootstock precisely because this rootstock is supposed to give better tolerance to alkaline soils.
So I would guess that is one species that might pass on tolerance to alkalinity.
Of course so-called “laxa” rootstock is actually this :
https://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=2.6091.4&tab=1

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I chased laxa supply for years from N/A local and regional vendors with no luck.

Driver was a lot of the pioneer “prairie hybridizer” of the last century used it, and spinos for breeding because grows well and hardy in prairies full of ancient mega Lake Agassiz derived sediments - same in my zone 4A foothills climate and soil.

As most know the story goes Multiflora (likes acidic granitic based regosol soil origins) and Dr Huey rootstock (likes alkaline/calcareous regosol origins) favoured by “big” producers either both not hardy, and/or find “alkaline soil” tough going. Tried both now have more jaundice eye.

The answer to my quest came from Canada, an Albertan rosarian mentioned to me there was what seemed to be a 100 ft long hedge of giants 2 hours away - and two ploidy found by Dr Z (“corroborate person refer never did as trust source). Directed to them by the rosarian.

The tetraploid version bloomed last year, waiting for the diploid.

Well on the way to being supplied now, including a much sought after “pink” Rosa beggeriana nigrescens from the far east from “Ami” a Canadian eastern hybridizer of hardies (lucky surprise for me from Loubert sales mixup).

Also received again from the Eastern Canadian hybridizer “Ami” (got to remember to use masculine spelling, sorry about that) doc’d Rosa Laxa Retz… Originally sourced from MBG.

Of note to me is its use in the heritage tall and/or climber hardy alkaline tolerant roses Wright’s Scarlet Ranger, and Skinners Isabelle Skinner (Victorian Memory in American because Canadian commercial could not recognize it back in the day as of potential garden merit).

Like most roses they also have weaknesses.

Scarlet Ranger bloomed first time in dappled shade … strange color but pleasing … not “scarlet” but a deep rich pink in my garden.

The bloom life in partial shade lasted over two weeks and could not help seeing a parallels (or wishful thinking?) in tea-like dropping malleable bloom (its not) - kind of unique - wait for firming up long term opinion.

As to short, hardy and no thorns non-rugosa … no help there as rugosa is what l have … and everything else is taller than 2 feet - except the spino hybrid moderns.

The rugosas l don’t appreciate fully, mainly due 50% of my varieties get rugosa anemia and buy them as plug-ins for back north garden.

Though did germinate some micro minis from using Ross Rambler 1 and Suzanne with a nordic (non- hardy) gallica. No idea if will thrive and years away from hardiness testing courage and not likely to repeat. But don’t care at this stage because if color transfer the Bentley W12 may come next.

Noticed though the usual, the closer to “true physiology” of origins, rugosa anemia is a nearly a certainty in my garden. More breeding away then less prone but out goes tip hardy (Hunter).

Too bad about pops with grub hoe - meant well l assume.

Good luck with the repeating metis avenue.

PS

Have u consider Knud repeating spinos as a starting point? Not sure about patent stuff of note to prevent their use.

Only two years into trialing here and boy they are short ~ 12 inches high … reminds me R Newman’s old song vs my bad attitude to short roses. They may catch the tall wave down the road.

Only technical issue l can think might be the nasty black spot stuff rumoured to also occur west of Chicago into mid- west. East doomed for spinos as l read.

From HelpMeFind

R. laxa hybrid x hybrid tea [Skinner] A descendent of ‘Gruss an Teplitz’ x (R. laxa x R. gallica) (P. Wright corresp. To W. Schowalter 8/30/70)[Pittao]

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It crosses not too difficultly with rugosa’s.

Until I got r. clinophylla the OP bracteata that survived were obvious rugosa crosses. Rugosa’s accept bracteata pollen too. They are thorny in a mean mean mean way though so beware.

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I also suspect that Pierre’s rose has both R. bracteata and R. rugosa in its background. Abundant, vicious thorns certainly explain the whole “Cat Woman” marketing vibe (kitty has claws, after all). One commercially available rose in the U.S. with a bracteata-rugosa parentage is the Lens rose Pink Surprise.

Stefan

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Ralph’s “Magseed” was an unusual Rugosa hybrid - akin to ‘Linda Campbell’ in style, but it was very fertile. I think it had a lot of potential to make some unique hybrids.

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Those of you in Europe may be able to still find this. Meilland sold it in 1997 as Red Rugostar. 'MAGseed' Rose

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This is interesting. I’ll put it in my wishlist :slight_smile:

At the moment I’m trying another Rugosa of Moore. Topaz Jewel, on Schneezwerg. I’ll keep you posted if anything comes from it.

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I was just thinking that Topaz Jewel might be an interesting pairing with bracteata lines as well.

I would have sworn that I had earlier on this post asked about recreating Geshwind’s seigera/rugosa lines with some newer cultivars. (Ah, precocious senility…) Anybody have thoughts/insights on pursuing such?

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I’ve acquired Red Rugostar here in Europe, but I think there is a difference in plant and flower compaired to the pictures on HMF. Could you post some pictures of the flowers and leaves of your Red Rugostar? Mine are somewhat double. Not that robust. Still in pot though, so maybe it has to buff up a bit.

This Paul Barden photo on Help Me Find is precisely what I saw in my own garden (in cool weather) and at Sequoia Nursery for decades. 'Magseed' Rose Photo My photos 'MAGseed' Rose Photo and 'MAGseed' Rose Photo show how it appeared in inland valley high heat in Southern California. It can vary a bit in petal count due to climate and culture and the color is a bit darker and richer in cooler weather. What does yours look like?




Looks different in many ways. :pensive:

I think I’ve been sold this one, but labeled as Red Rugostar: Super Rugostar: 'Super Rugostar' Rose

Red Rugostar is probably not available anymore in Europe. Not in Meilands catalogue anymore.
Lets hope this one does set hips. It doesn’t look very “hip-setting”, but who knows. I really like to know the parentage of the roses I work with. With this one… not available. That is disappointing. :grimacing: