Three representative leafs from “Hansa” front yard on left, and “Hansa dark flower” on right.
Difference in geometry, size and especially where leaf meets stem start of leaf.
“Dark Hansa” plunges at an acute angle as per narrow leaf trait, while “Hansa” “ normalis ?”edge arches above origin connecting point.
What a great potential find from St Petes… nursery via Finnish id.
How it got here in back garden have not a clue. Local or nursery acquired l don’t know and my garden notes not that detailed on vendor.
Hannu big thanks for drawing my attention to it - definitely going to baby it with new found “rugosa respect” as tentative “Empress / Queen of the North” … ah how apropos.
Like to call it the other name but defer as long long ago relative escaped and only travelled at night back to the village in the late 1800’s.
Empress of the North starting bloom today.
Going to be striking cuttings like mad - but need to wait as West country’s Lands End calls for now.
U got an excellent eye relative to mine.
2 Likes
Thanks for lithograph - will have a thorough read.
I am scheduled by my “tourist itinerary” this coming week to go to Kew and RHS Wisely for a sniff around so l will have look if they have any labelled “Rugosa” as per mention in “lithograph” of the late Kew Dr. when he discusses the rose in question (quick scanned your attachment during morning coffee and cigar).
The rose is at least nearly as old as my back garden so anywhere from 15 to 23 years of age - need to check master list to see if l documented years Hansa’s put in. Had one massive die down a few years ago that its still recovering from after going 5-6 feet high. Agree with your growth description.
In keeping with my many zones gambles there are only likely three possible commercial sources for this rose as “Hansa” in my garden history.
I never saw Hansa marketed in the local nurseries as Hansa as they go for the latest and last recent here in semi hardy - so they are not likely the source.
The other is the notorious “get lucky” mega Canadian importer of southern US grown older Huey rootstock bare root roses they stuff-in boxes bags and pots. l would occasionally buy these if l felt lucky (and this year and my bourbon was not again Zeffy but some red HT). Actually found a couple years back an unlabelled mutablis l recognized from past adventurous zone testing.
Then there is the reputable Pickering Ontario mail order rose grower of the past (immigrant experienced Dutch rose man started in 50’s/60s, after a New York sojourn - Schraven s.p.?). I betting on Pickering as bought common and some hard to find rugosas from them (even the good make mistakes - in my favour in this case). On multiflora rootstock and others.
Never bought Hansa from other sources l use.
My plants were mainly Pickering until 2018 (son inherited and folded company up).
2 Likes
If you have HMF premium, you can advanced-search the combination diploid with zone 2 or 3, and add in repeat bloom cycle. Some interesting roses emerge.
3 Likes
Odds are good R. rugosa flore pleno is in circulation on the prairies as Georges Bugnet used it in his early rose hybridizing efforts. In 1942 he notes “Hansa” as being located at the University of Alberta and in 1943 he shows crosses using “Rosa rugusa flore pleno”. Apparently he thought they were different cultivars. We also know Bugnet received seeds of Pinus sylvestris `Ladoga’ from Petrograd in 1917. He could have acquired Rugosa flore pleno seeds as well.
1 Like
Hi Margit,
All marked Hansa’s (hedge size) at the Kew rose garden northish of Palm House do not appear to my eyes to have the Calgary Hansa “ Dark Flower “ narrower leaflet form.
Therese Bugnet displayed beside Wild Edric … good show by Georges.
**Update Aug 19 2023 **
ID my mystery rose as Roseraire de L’Hay. Leaf form, bloom form, aging to magenta makes it a dead ringer for it, and leaves narrower than Hansa leaves and it hints of rugosa.
Better still it makes sense as bought it and Parfum de l’Hay from Pickering long ago.
Parfum blooms not same, and color too carmine and leaves appear “less” rugosa like.
