You’re welcome! Happy New Year!

La Marne seems to be the closest roses in idea + genetics. There are obvious glaring differences though. My first worry would be ploidy, although multiflora triploids dont really tend to be picky.

My personal intention would be to retain, preserve and reinforce the color pattern. It tends to be fleeting and muddy with this group of roses. However, I can see the potentional in raising more modern, healthier types like this with patterns that actually persist. Its the main reason I avoided La Marne – the color was so manic-depressive, depending entirely on the week. So I can see th epotential of this retention with Doc.

Connie Hilker of Hartwood Roses Nursery in Hartwood, Virginia has several of the Dwarf series. She usually has a twice a year gathering of the “rosaholics” from the area (out of staters too) and we have a potluck lunch. We were all impressed with the Dwarfs. They had some of the healthiest foliage I have ever seen. Nice small but full and bushy plants and pretty small foliage. As I recall most had very shiny foliage. There were thorns on the canes but I would say moderately armed! The flowers were nice too. Rich colors. I believe she mentioned she lacked one or two of the series and they no longer seemed available.


Happy New Year and 2011 everyone!.

So I was pruning back everything died from the winter snap in Walla Walla, WA over my Xmas break there. It was one of those false summers in November that became 5 degrees in one day flat. Singin in the Rain and All that Jazz were the hardest hit, unfortunately. However, there were two roses that were unphased whatsoever. And one of those two was completely disease free and trying to grow. The first was Silver Cloud, which is pretty much like true mauve Escapade in plant architecture. It gets mildew but it blooms non-stop. Its a very odd but useful rose if you dont live where it mildews. The other was Birthday Girl, which is why I am mentioning this all here. It is likely the exact same parentage as Easter Basket, [Carefree Beauty x (Strawberry Ice x Gold Marie 82)]. This rose has been healthy in both mildew areas and blackspot areas and grows like a contained weed. It has a moderate sweet scent and the color is like that of Double Delight, only subdued. It sets hips. If any of ya’ll are looking for that red/white or pink/white blended effect (like Doc too) but dont want to deal with the mess that Double Delight, Double Perfection, Strawberry Ice, Erfurt, etc., then this also is a viable option for any of you out there. I do not know how hardy it goes down to but I imagine its similar to Buck roses give its Buck, Kordes and polyantha influence. I am assuming that the other half of Doc is something similar to Pink Fragrance, specifically Orange Triumph x Golden Rapture. Both are known to produce these color patterns, as is Peace but Peace doesnt look like part of the equation.

EuroDesert has them all. Jim Delahanty is a great friend who grows them and lives about five minutes away. They aren’t popular with the exhibitionists around here because they dont’ begin to flower until June, easily 3 - 4 months later than any other poly. My observation of them and experience with a few are they do tend to be fairly clean. Dopey is a muddy, dull crimson here and the flowers NEVER shed their petals, instead turning brilliant green with age. It always impressed me as being possible to raise green flowers from it. I don’t care for how “arthritic” Dopey seems. The canes seem severely angled at each node, more like a dwarf than a midget version of a full sized plant. Kim

Interesting because the reason I knew Happy first is because it won instantly anytime it was shown at either Portland Rose Show as a polyantha. Personally, I wanted to use it as a base for red poly diploid type stud by mixing some combination maybe contain 2 or more of Happy, Bukavu, Sanguinea, Chevy Chase and Red Fairy as one. Then I could use it for species, etc. to broaden range.

IDK Doc’s ploidy but I’d like to see Marie Bugnet x Doc. I think the potential for a diploid red/white blended, everyblooming nordic rose would be possible.

Their ability to bloom your season is logical. Your season begins later and is shorter. They were bred and selected in an area more approximating your climate than ours so they perform more appropriately for you then for us.

I’ve been considering crossing Comtesse du Cayla with Mutabilis since I saw the Comtesse at the Sacremento Cemetery. She was huge and as full of flower as Mutabilis was in the same area. Her colors were as amazing as they are here. Mine, unfortunately, has been stunted by being in a can far too long. Something I must correct very soon. Because La Marne is half Comtesse, crossing her with Mutabilis is a natural, particularly as she was nearly as large as the Comtesse in the Cemetery.

That raises the question of classification for such crosses. The Comtesse is called a China, even though she’s a quarter Bengale/China/Tea and three quarters Tea. La Marne is half multiflora hybrid/poly and half Comtesse. I think I’ll add the China (Mutabilis) to the mix and call is a Hybrid Species. It has as much logic to it! LOL!

Call it a rose :smiley: Even children understand it lol. Its a nice idea. Blends can be so nice and calming when done right.

Doing a bit of research for black spot resistant polys and minis has yeilded the following suggestions. From Paul Barden and his no spray period, the near totally clean to totally clean results are: Apricot Twist, Cal Poly, Cinderella, Magic Wand, Rose Gilardi, Unconditional Love. Burling responded that the two best from Sequoia times and in her nursery are Cal Poly and Pink Petticoat. Seeking advice from Jim Delahanty about polys, Paul Delepine impresses him greatly (EuroDesert) as far as bloom production, health and vigor. He adds that Happy and Bashful are the best of the Seven Dwarfs with Doc coming in third. He offers the others don’t flower enough (in SoCal) to make them worthy of use. Cliff also carries this one which seems rather interesting.