A friend of mine a few properties up from mine has several hundred acres and has offered me the use of part of one of his paddocks to grow stocks of my recent registrations so that I may begin to release my own roses myself. I like the sound of this but I worry about being able to manage weeds in a field situation among roses. The first ones I am thinking of taking up there are ‘Bullseye’ and one I’ve recently registered called ‘Green ‘n’ Gold’. ‘Bullseye’ is only lightly thorned but it is not a large grower and would easily be smothered by weeds. ‘Green ‘n’ Gold’ is well endowed with thorns and would be difficult to weed around when grown in the field. I’m also very busy and would not be able to get up there as often as might be needed to control weeds and I can’t ask my friend to manage them as he is busy enough working the farm and contracting out the machinery he has. I do own a small tractor but do not have a rotary hoe or some other cultivataing attachment yet. I have a grader on it to maintain my long gravel driveway. How are weeds managed in large commerical enterprises? The paddock is about 50 acres in size and I’ve been offered several complete rows to begin with. Is it worthwhile laying down very long lengths (potentially hundreds of metres of it), of weedmatting and planting the roses in this?
Weed block sounds expensive, but also about the only way to hope to get control to any degree you can live with. Unless you can afford to pay someone to handle them for you?
I suppose a pre-emergent herbicide might help, something like Surflan or Treflan.
We just cultivate and hoe.
I’d be wiling to bet that a large commercial organization would use some sort of preemergent herbicide.
I recommend that you do not use something like Surflan or Treflan without the farmer’s O.K. (assuming he fully understands the chemicals) and that you also become aware of the possible risks involved to your water supply (I assume that you have well water) and to your family.
Scientists use both to double chromosomes.
http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=surflan+chromosomes&hl=en&btnG=Search&as_sdt=136&as_sdtp=on
http://home.roadrunner.com/~kuska/chromosome.htm
I suggest hiring a middle school or early high school student to hand weed.
Hi Simon,
I am aware that some of the larger rose growers in the US have employed soil fumigants to basically “sterilize” the soil. The chemical is applied to the soil and then it is covered with plastic for several days. It is my understanding that some of these chemicals have been taken off the market due to the concerns that Henry highlighted above.
Kim is right that fabric weed block would be too expensive. I tried using it on a smaller scale and was disappointed with the number of weeds that still sprouted.
As Henry suggested, hiring some of your students might be the safest and most economical option - and you might recruit a budding new rose breeder or two…!
As mentioned somewhere else Simon, mounded beds will reduce, not eliminate a lot of weeds. I know you do not like chemicals much but you might have to use some prior to planting and trying to leave the beds fallow for as long as possible. another thought, have you any access to bales of hay/straw or similar, mulch will help as you know to reduce the germination of weeds. This might sound silly, here in town the owner of motel is refurbishing his roms. I have claimed all the carpet from 39 rooms, already layed down 6 in the garden, if you can find some, you could cut in row widths and use it.
The chemicals he uses already include pre-emergent herbicides (and everything else you can think of… scary really). To be honest I didn’t even think of them. I don’t really want to go down that path. Maybe I’ll just stick to pots instead.
Hi Simon
Why not lay plastic / polythene. I use this and poke rootstock cuttings through. They will grow weed free and the plastic acts as a mulch and conserves water. The plastic is economical and lasts several years and this is enough time to evaluate the seedlings that I bud onto the rootstock. Testing on cutting grown plants can be done later. I guess seedling cuttings could be used in the stead of rootstock?
I think you may be commiting too much of your time to weed control otherwise, just when you want to be pollinating and enjoying summer.
Beg, borrow or hire a rotary hoe and get the soil turned up. You can use a tractor implement to bury the plastic edges but I just do it by hand. I plant a double row of rootstock per strip of plastic with about 15cm of plastic on each side. I use a weed killer to spray off the weeds that come up at the plastic edges. Buster is the brand I use as it has little effect on the plants if I inadvertantly get any on a rose. If there is water available put T Tape or soaker hose under the plastic but this is not crucial.
Now is a good time to get your rootstock cuttings in!
All the best
Mike
Hi Mike,
Where in NZ is Gisbourne? Does it get very hot there? Do you have any trouble with excessive heat under the plastic?
By the way, Mike. I was looking through your roses recently (and again tonight) and I really like the look of ‘Thank You’. ‘Baby Faurax’ has just arrived here this winter ready to be used this season as well… looking forward to it 
Loving the look of ‘Loving Care’ too!
Loving Care IS very intriguing and beautiful! Great idea for parents.
Hi Simon
Gisborne is the eastern most city on the North Island. Our summer temps are in the 20 /30 deg C range with the occasional hotter period. I have never had any problems with excessive heat. You can purchase plastic mulch that is white on one side and black on the other if your temps are more extreme. The plants themselves will provide sufficient shading. Your horticultural supply company will have good local advice.
I am glad to hear you like my roses and I am sure you will have fun with Baby Faurax. I am still using it. Most recently onto Immensee. This created a nice array of purples on impossibly large plants. My most useful breeder is a cross of Fairyland X Baby faurax.
Kim. Thanks, I’m pleased you like it.
Mike
Hi Mike. This sounds like a great idea. Your conditions sound identical to ours. I don’t suppose I could trouble you to take a few photos to post here could I?
I purchase “short” rolls of the paper that newspapers use. I then put some mulch on to prevent the wind from blowing it away.
Simon, is there a cost effective source of shredded tree trimming material, or is it all eucalyptus type stuff? Perhaps if you could locate enough “waste” product of a suitable texture, it would make maintaining the rows easier?
Maybe try your local government offices like the city parks and recreation department. Like in my area the city shreds their tree trimmings and what they do not use is free for the taking. It is not perfect woodchip mulch that many people prefer. It has some seeds in it but far less than if you would leave the soil bare. It also has leaves chipped right in. But I prefer the leafy kind anyways because it adds more humus to the soil that way.
Henry suggestion for the paper I can attest can be effective. Just put some layers of paper and some mulch over it. it does not work as well in really wet climates and is not as long term of a solution as weed barriers.
Some one told me once that corn meal can be used as a pre-emergent pesticide. You might look into that but I have no idea if it even works.
The wood chip/mulching/carpet/paper ideas are not very practical for this as the area is so large and my understanding is that it takes at least two-three years to get cutting grown roses to a good size for sale. The black plastic idea sounds good and I can get rolls of it cheaply. I think it would be time effecient too. The paddock is at least 50 acres with rows several hundred metres long. Thinking about Mike’s idea the plan is to build up stock of ‘parent plants’ and collect as many cuttings as I can, wrap them in up in winter to pre-callous them and then, whilst the callouses are nice and fat, move along the plastic mounds with a punch of some kind and insert the cuttings directly into the ground so they can produce roots directly into the ground. Robert Rippetoe mentioned some years ago that the amount of time needed to get cutting grown (non-miniature) plants to a saleable size was considerably longer than grafted plants so I need to choose less labour intensive practises that can be sustained over a few years and in the process start to get rotations started. I’m not sure I’m going to like moving along rows 2-300 metres long with a shovel to bury the sides of the plastic but if it works well then it’s worth it in the long run. I’m also not sure how you’d get fertilisers to the plants with the black plastic around them. Foliar feeding might work but I don’t know how effective this is for roses.
Simon
I will try and get some pics for you but will not be able to do this before the weekend.
Why do you want to grow and sell field grown plants from cuttings? Budded plants will be sale ready in 18months, budding is pretty easy, you only need one stool bed for rootstock and your market is familiar with this product. If you intend to grow standards it will be a must.
If you are going to put in rows that are several hundred meters long I would get a plastic layer attachment for your tractor. They clip on easily and you will fly through it in no time. Ask around, you will be suprised how many are about. Start with vege growers as they all seem to have one and don’t mind lending them out. For such a big area you could use the narrow plastic, do single rows and broadcast fert between the rows as required. The roots easily extend beyond the plastic.
Mike
[size=small]
Lots of reasons, Mike:
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If a rose doesn’t grow well for me on its own roots it is discarded.
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I can bud but I don’t want to.
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Most the roses I choose as parents root easily and also grow quickly on their own roots.
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Growing my seedlings from cuttings guranatees they won’t contract viruses like RMV. I grew about 300 open pollinated thornless multiflora seedlings about 5 years ago now to avoid using possibly virused understocks and chose the strongest one to keep as a stock plant for understocks but I generally only use it for propagating my own garden plants from material sent to me by friends at times of the year when my cuttings are less successful.
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I tend have very good luck striking roses from cuttings and many grow very well on their own roots.
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I don’t intend to grow standards unless specifically requested. I’ve only ever made one and it was fun but I did it just to get ‘Sweet Chariot’ up off the ground to make pollinating it easier and to get the hips up and away from the critters more.
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The roses I am looking at breeding at this stage are mostly groundcover/landscape type roses. I find these suit own-root type growing and I appreciate the more natural growth pattern that occurs when not being pushed along by a rampant understock.
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Plants of my rose called ‘Bullseye’ reach 2ft tall from 15cm cuttings in 2 years. It is a wichurana hybrid so strikes like easily and grows quickly. A hybrid musk-like seedling of mine reached 6ft high and wide in 18 months and it strikes like a weed. It’s once flowering but carries repeat from ‘Sweet Chariot’ (it is ‘Sweet Chariot’ x “Poynton’s Multiflora” and nicknamed “Sweet Flora”), and I have seedlings up now that are it x ‘Monsieur Tillier’ and I hope they will be repeaters with similar vigour with larger semi-double flowers in large trusses in that wonderful colour range MTillier has in a Hybrid Musk-like plant. I grew 60 Flower Carpet Pink plants last winter by pruning my large own-root plant and just mounding up the ground and sticking the cuttings in the ground. Every one of them struck and half of them were ready for sale this winter 12 months after ‘planting’. Their stems were about 10mm wide which is about as wide as the width of the understocks of the grafted plants I received from Treloars this year with good thick rope-like roots. My laevigata cuttings went from cuttings to 3ft tall and wide in just 6 months… imagine what could be possible with laevigata own-root vigour in roses! I think there is the capacity for rapid growth by choosing parents carefully.
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The less fuss I need to make over growing plants the better.
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If I can just stick a cutting in the ground and away it goes then that has to cut down the labour costs and it develops an excellent root system compared to growing them in pots. They develop long thick branch-like roots instead of masses of fiborous roots… perfect for mail-order plants.
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I did an experiment a few years back with some cuttings of ‘Red Cascade’, ‘Magic Carrousel’, and ‘Green Ice’ which are all roses that strike easily anyway, and found that if I cut very small cuttings consisting of just two buds; one above the ground and one that I cut through the middle and stick into the sand/potting mix, that they will strike well and grow on nicely to make a saleable sized rose in two years with good feeding, water, and light. This makes them almost as productive as budded plants in that I can get many plants from a single stem.
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I like the longer lived plants own-roots make.
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Own-root roses avoids graft incompatibilities that may develop quickly or over time.
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It just seems like an unnecessary middle-man-like step in the process that could be cut out just by selecting seedlings suited to own-root production.
Ask around, you will be suprised how many are about. Start with vege growers as they all seem to have one and don’t mind lending them out.
Now that you mention it, I think I do know someone with one!!! Great idea!
For such a big area you could use the narrow plastic
Another great idea! Thanks, Mike. I appreciate your advice [/size]
I use and recommend cornmeal for weeds in general, but I have not tried it in my seedling beds as I do not know how it would affect the root growth of my seedlings.