Here in Oz I have used R. indica major for years. It gives good bud unions, bud growth is good, I read somewhere that is also slightly nematode resistant and can tolerate higher alkaline soils than multiflora. The only drawback , which does not worry me is its thorns.
Simon,
Canina has never mildewed for me or in nature here.
Rosa rubiginosa that is feral in Idaho does mildew in the late summer to autumn. I never saw Canina there, though.
The Canina x Multiflora seedlings mildewed upon germination, and 99+% of them were culled for the one that I eventually kept. It is clean here, but it isnt like I ran out and tested my new hybrid of semi-noxious weed lol.
re: rooting. Try to use canina over rubiginosa. I used canina over rubiginosa for 4 primary reasons, despite rubiginosa being slightly hardier.
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It has far better color, and it even has some slight yellow in a few random selections.
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It is wayyyy easier to root, likely because it is kind of the synstylae of the caninae family.
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mildew! Canina lacks the extra plant parts that seem to get infected on rubiginosa – much like moss roses get mildew, rubiginosa can too.
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My Rosa primula was grafted on Rosa rubiginosa. In fact, that was the seed parent to my seedlings of it. I let it overgrow on purpose, but taking it out was horrible because it is more prickly and woody that Dr. Huey, Multiflora, or Canina.
Simon as there is a discussion about rootstock here , how does (Poynton’s Multiflora) gow as one
David, “Poynton’s Multiflora” does ok as an understock; however, I have better and more vigorous, thornless, multiflora plants to use now too that came up as suckers from bought roses that weren’t properly disbudded. I don’t know what its virus status is (I’m assuming it’s infected) so I intend to use it as a parent instead. “Poynton’s Multiflora” is more of a shrub than a rampant rambler like other multiflora and so it is not as vigorous as other multiflora plants. It makes a really good understock for minis and is especially good for making 3ft mini standards. This is what I used to make my ‘Sweet Chariot’ standard. It doesn’t push them along too hard and turn minis into shrubs. I have a few other roses grafted onto it around the place (like my very first seedling that I call “The Ugly Duckling”, ‘Dainty Bess’, ‘Tuscany’, ‘Russelliana’, and ‘Francis Dubreuil’) and they do well on it. I think it would be more useful in developing harder growing understocks by marrying it to other more vigorous roses. I’m curious what would happen if 'Lamarque’was put onto it in terms of making a good rootstock for Australian roses. I put it onto ‘Temple Bells’ (see above) and have made a much stronger plant that I think will be much better as an understock though it is very thorny. The ‘Indica Major’ x “Poynton’s Multiflora” seems to be a good candidate too. I have shared this rose with Bruce for testing in Sydney and reports so far are very positive. It’s a pretty rose in itself.
There are so many other really strong growing roses that could possibly be used. For instance Rosa longicuspis var. sinowilsonii makes thumb thickness new growth that will reach 10ft long in a single season, grows exceptionally strongly to develop a wide reaching drought tolerant root system and it strikes very easily. It is super thorny; however, so would be best used in breeding rootstocks that are less well armed. It would be no good in many parts in the U.S. because it is tender and would not survive their winters. Here… it grows all year round which raises another question for me… when you put evergreen rootstocks under roses that want to go dormant in the winter what happens?
Thanks Simon
I got lucky, I had given some of my spare R.multiflora XOP seedlings to my uncle when I kept the one smooth R.multiflora seedling as rootstock (it later got chlorotic in very sandy soil and was culled).
I managed to get cuttings from one of those R. multiflora XOP seedling sibs yesterday, hopefully one of these will strike and prove ok as a rootstock.
…have to wait another year now for these to grow up (assuming they strike).
:O)
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Thank goodness R.multiflora is not outlawed my side of the world.
Some of you from Oz may have heard of a rose grower from northern Sydney (ex Dural and Epping) named Robby Engal (has passed on).
Many years ago he told me that in years gone by, the Sweet Briar rose (Hybrid Rubiginosa / Canina section) was sometimes used as rootstock in some parts of Australia. I don’t know if it actually ever was used for my region, but now many years later I have a feeling some Rosa Canina types might be currently oultawed here in NSW, but I am not 100% certain about that either (nor which specific ones). I wont be using it.
Just go to the south island of New Zealand and you will see acres upon acres of canina growing wild
Has Canina escaped and grown wild in parts of NSW as well?
Three weeks later and the above two (thin) multiflora seedling cuttings have roots popping out of the drainage holes…that’s more like it !
I discovered many years ago Cardinal Hume roots like a weed, accepts many scions and never suffers chlorosis in my conditions. I checked the tag on the Baby Faurax standard I budded in 1994 yesterday. 18 years and this thing keeps on chugging. I figured it was safe to use as the plant was direct from Harkness and had never been budded on to here.
This is my ‘Indica Major’ x ‘Poynton’s Multiflora’ : Plant Search
Looking better all the time and strikes very easily. Not too shabby to look at either.
Simon,
what sort of length do the canes get to. Do you think they would support standards or maybe weeping standards.
It isn’t just the strength of the cane being able to support weight, David. It’s also the ability of the stock to flow sufficient sap over the length of the trunk. IXL used to be used here for standard trunks, but it sunburns badly and requires much room to grow as mother plants. Huey replaced it, but doesn’t flow enough sap to successfully support a head on trunks longer than about 3’. We used to be able to buy 4’ through 8’ weeping standards. Alas, no more. Both due to costs of producing them; outrageous shipping and the inability of the current stock to keep the sap flowing over those lengths.
Yes Kim, I understand that part of it. When I was at the rose nursery, we used a form of ‘multiflora’ which worked well
Hard to say what length canes it can make yet, David, or how hard it will push the scion. It is a 2010 seedling and still has some growing up to do. At the moment I’m thinking it won’t make long enough canes to support standards unless they are those mini-standards of about 30-40cm tall that were made for pots but it would be unsuitable for this purpose I think because it has such a huge root system. It would fill a pot too quickly and then begin to suffer.
I do have a multiflora plant here that makes very nice long straight canes to about 5-6ft long if you are looking for something to make tall standards.
“Poynton’s Multiflora” makes decent 3ft standards. This is a ‘Sweet Chariot’ standard that I made with it so that if I decide to pollinate it the flowers would be at a more comfortable height. This photo was taken on the 5th of Nov. It’s about to explode with flowers. It is in its 3rd year now. I’ll be making an identical one of ‘Nozomi’ and ‘Laura Ashley’ to go with it.
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Imagine a tall weeping standard stuck on top of one of these canes!
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Just curious about Fortuniana rootstock’s advantages and disadvantages. I ordered some Dr. Huey and Fortuniana rootstock from UC Davis this fall. Waiting for these and some cuttings of a thorn less multiflora plant I got from an RHA member decades ago to root.
I was going to ask about fortuniana as well, though it doesn’t meet the hardiness requirements at the top of this post. I understand it makes for an exceedingly vigorous plant where it is happy as a rootstock.