I have a bunch of seedlings that grow vigorously but do not bloom. Anyone has some experience with this kind of behavior. Many of my tiny seedlings bloom after 60 days under growing lights through the winter. But the better ones which grow and grow, does not show any flower. Should I wait for the next winter dormancy to see blooms from these quick growers in Spring ?
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What roses are you using for parents? Are you using any once blooming roses, rugosas or climbers as parents, or are all your parents modern repeat blooming shrub types? Your choice of parents could account for the lack of juvenile blooming.
Mark
Thank you, Mark, I am using modern repeat blooming roses as seed and pollen parent. I do not have once blooming roses. With roses one never knows where they come from genetically. It could be that those not blooming have inherited this trait from the ancestors, but would they bloom later in the season or in the coming years?
I don’t know if this is related or throws any light, but I have a miniature rose called Peter Pan, which repeat flowers prolifically through many months, that I have taken several cuttings from and planted in various spots. The original plant flowers prolifically and has a good compact growth habit, and some of the cuttings are the same size now and also flower prolifically, but two of the cuttings, in different spots, just did not flower and had a leggier growth habit, one seemed to have turned into a climber with no flowers.
I am only speculating here and I am not any kind of expert, but I wonder if you took cuttings from those seedlings, when they are big enough, if some of those cuttings would flower? Maybe the experts here can give their thoughts?
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Hello Julie, Thank you! My seedlings are grown from seeds during the winter in Scandinavia and after 90 days in the fridge, they sprout and normally after 60 days they show a flower. I do not know if there are some difference if it is cutting or seeds, but the same happens with some of my seedlings, that grow like climbers without showing any flowers. I was curious to know if these would ever bloom, and if someone had experienced them blooming in the second growing season or later.
Some seedlings simply take longer to reach a point where they are ready to flower. Way back when I made the cross of 0-47-19 X Crepuscule, I had a couple hundred seedlings, most of which flowered in the first 3 months. I discarded most of the ones that did not flower first year, but I held onto one seedling that had exceptional vigor and very healthy foliage, in spite of the fact that it had not flowered in its first year.
That plant turned out to be ‘Mel’s Heritage’, which is known for its ability to flower 12 months of the year (in the right climate). So if you are growing seedlings from two modern, repeating parents, don’t assume too much about their flowering habits based on what they do in year one.
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Hello Paul,
Thank you for sharing your experience on my question. I appreciate it. I have seen some of your roses at Roque Valley Roses. They are very beautiful - some of my favorites are Oshun and definitely Mel’s Heritage, a work of art! but all your roses a very beautiful!
It is very reassuring to know that some of my " not flowering" seedlings can indeed flower after some time, and even show the ability of extraordinary flowering. I will definitely take good care of these ones and see what the coming years will bring. It is also quite difficult for me to discard such vigorous plants, and some of them seem to be very healthy ones. I am in my second year on rose breeding and I really enjoy every step of the process. I have not achieved my goal of creating a rose that falls into my wishes, repeat flowering, healthy, globular with big scented blooms. But I will keep on trying until I reach it.
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If you cross only repeat-flowering roses, then those seedlings whith no juvenile bloom will be probably once-bloomers. It can happen that even though the parents are repeat-bloomers, a smaller proportion of their progeny can loose that trait. If you are breeding for repeat blooming, those seedlings would be no need for you. You can leave one or too, of course, to wait for their bloom. It can also happen that they are still repeat bloomers, but bloom much later in season, however this happens rarely.
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Thank you, Giessen. Much appreciated. It makes so much sense and explains the differences. I breed with the intention of getting repeat bloomers and so far I have not seen flowers from the vigorous growers from last year. My juvenile blommers are actually giving me some new flowers.
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Thanks, glad you appreciate my (very old) work.
If you’ve used modern remontant parents for your work (as opposed to using Portlands and that sort, which are unlikely to produce repeating seedlings when crossed with anything else), than I recommend saving the healthiest, most vigorous seedlings with the best architecture for at least one more year and see if they don’t start to show remontancy traits.
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Thanks, Paul. I will definitely follow your recommendation and I have already chosen some of the healthiest and well branched ones and see what time will bring.
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I am experiencing the same behavior in open pollinated blooms of the climber Florentina. I have about 35 seedlings, where seven have bloomed after 90 days. The remainder are primarily strong tall growing plants - no buds. I do have a few once bloomers but they are quite a distance away. Thank you for the comments.
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