I’m sure many of you recieved the same e-mail that I did that Vintage Gardens is closing this summer. I hope that Burling will carry some of the older roses. I can’t believe all of the rose nurseries that are going belly up.
The worst thing about this one closing is they had a very unique collection.
Hopefully someday soon we will hit the bottom and we will begin to see things turn around. I honestly don’t see that happening but maybe.
I know I am on the otherside of the world or on the bottom of it. Is it possible to read a current stock list, not a catalogue so much. More the ones saved from previous closures or hard to get stock. If this makes sense.
I’ve tried downloading their availability list several times and I get error messages. I also spent most of the day going over their listings and cross referencing with HMF to find roses that I want. I should have known adding them to my cart and not keep a hand written list was a bad idea. Their shopping cart will crash after a couple of hours. Oh well. I went back and filled in the best I could remember.
Adam: I agree that they have a good collection. Most though are ordered by “custom root” and can take over a year. I’m like a four-year-old when it comes to ordering/wanting my plants. I want them NOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWW!
=[ This blows. I’m thinking many, many offensive words which are not PC-friendly.
This was inevitable. In case it hadn’t been obvious, we are entering another of those “great extinction events” that rose cultivation experiences every 70-100 years (do your research; there is a pattern), and nothing we do can prevent it. Many, many roses will disappear both from commerce and from dwindling private collections. We’ve already witnessed the demise of at least half of the commercial entities in the past few years. There will be some brave individuals who will hang on as best they can to the most rare and valued of cultivars, but its unlikely that any of us will see a genuine resurgence of interest in the genus in our lifetimes. Pessimistic viewpoint, you say? Maybe so, but I think its the reality, so I’m preparing for it.
On the positive side, this will be a weeding-out process whereby many mediocre, redundant and inferior roses will be culled from existence, and the truly superior selections will rise to the top. I think that’s a good thing. Sure, there will be some unfortunate losses when inevitably a few good roses will be lost as well, but we can’t stop that from happening.
On the positive side, this will be a weeding-out process whereby many mediocre, redundant and inferior roses will be culled from existence, and the truly superior selections will rise to the top. I think that’s a good thing. Sure, there will be some unfortunate losses when inevitably a few good roses will be lost as well, but we can’t stop that from happening.
You are probably right in that this can be a good thing. There are way to many sucky roses out there. I can think of several J&P selection for an example that should disappear. My greater fear is some valuable breeding stock disappearing. Looking at help me find over the years. Some of the most interesting species crosses probably had no garden merit but had merit to breeders. But we will never know because they no longer exist.
This sad cycle of nursery closures and loss of many rare cultivars makes me increasingly interested in ‘survivor’ roses, those varieties that seem to survive and thrive when left without care at old homesteads and cemeteries. What is it about these roses that makes them so tough, while other fine (as well as mediocre) roses dwindle away without human encouragement? Can they pass on this toughness to their offspring? What cultivars from our generation will still be found growing fifty or a hundred years from now?
Betsy
Minnesota zone 4
Currently land of the mountain-high snow piles
Jeff, if you study where many of these have survived, you’ll see a large part of many successes are because of other extenuating circumstances. Something less cold hardy surviving in a more extreme environment because it’s been “protected” by the remnants of a stone wall or chimney providing passive solar heating and/or shelter from extreme wind. Many have been found under the drip zones of very large oaks where deep mulch and frequent fogs and/or rains dripping off the canopy of the tree have kept them sufficiently irrigated as well as protected from the extremes of heat, frost and sunburn. Many have ‘survived’ in areas with sufficient rainfall/snowfall in soils with decent ground water available to keep them in existence. Not to disparage them, but virtually none are found in the middle of a bone dry field with nothing to protect them from blazing sun, extreme heat, desiccating high winds and lack of rainfall. SOMETHING helps protect them where they “survive”. I agree most appear to be very solid varieties, but had the survivors not lucked out with the fortune of good placement, they wouldn’t have remained to be ‘discovered’. Had they not been suitable for the climates in which they were “found”, they wouldn’t have efficiently made good use of their supporting elements.
Too many seem to feel since these are “survivors”, they don’t need anything to grow in the average garden. That usually isn’t the case. Fungal attacks are far less likely in an arid area under an oak drip zone where there is decent air movement and a dry soil surface compared to inhibited air circulation in an over crowded garden, particularly where humidity (and fungi pressures) are significantly higher. Just because a plant has survived for decades receiving condensed dews and fogs off other surfaces doesn’t mean it doesn’t require watering in your front yard. But, many you encounter at sales and on line seem to believe that’s the case. While many I’ve grown have been good garden subjects, they do require replacement of whatever supporting conditions which permitted their survival “in the wild” to survive when planted elsewhere. Too many just haven’t seemed to understand why they’ve lasted where they have.
Ha, ha! Kim, your post reminded me of a friend who killed a potted cactus by never watering it. “I thought that was the point,” she said.
Betsy
This is why I made sure I got one of the Gardens of the World at Heirlooms this year, even though there really isnt room for it – its one of those rare J/P “keepers” that can disappear.
The flowers on Gardens of the World do look delicous. How is the plant?
That’s funny, Jackie. Dealing with the public can be a real…‘hoot’. From the guy without a clue who returned the electric space heater because “it didn’t keep the bath water warm”. Yes, he PUT it IN the tub full of water with him and it worked perfectly…shorting out without injuring him. Did nothing to cleanse the gene pool, but… The woman who planted her bare roots IN the body bags then complained it wasn’t her fault as no one TOLD her to take them out of the bags. The guy whose glass eye fell out as he leaned over the Customer Service counter, bouncing a few times before the clerk turned back around in time to catch it. When she realized she had an EYE BALL in her hand, she screamed and threw it. He sued (and lost) for the replacement cost. People are just so often, so painfully clueless.
Gardens of the World appears to be one of the great, unsung roses J&P barfed out in the last twenty years. The flowers aren’t long lasting in high heat, but it is incredibly healthy and prolific in coastal areas in these parts. The one out back isn’t worth showing a photo of as it’s in the most helacious of spots, in terrible soil; gets fried all the time; battles rabbits, squirrels and moles and has pretty much never been pruned, which is what it appears to love. In the worst of conditions, it can rust a little, but that’s probably as due to extreme water stress as it is immune system. It grows and it flowers year round here, just doing its thing and never requiring anything more than getting hit with the hose. GOTW definitely appreciates not being pruned hard. Like Peace, it also likes just having the spent flowers snapped off, leaving all the foliage in place for it to use. This plant was shoved in its spot about the year it was introduced and it was watered weekly by hose all of its life. It’s a mass of about five feet cubed. It does root very easily, BTW, as I spread quite a few around last year from my cutting wraps.
Its a great plant, which is suprprising because Sunbright, one of its parents, is one of the worst HTs Ive ever encountered. I think it gets its health from the red line, from the other parent.
You’re probably right, Michael. Dame de Coeur was completely solid for me. Very healthy, dense, with great foliage and continuous flowering. I liked it very much and actually wish I still had it.
With Vintage going away I’ve decided I need to blow my 2013 budget before it’s too late.
I’ve check their availabilty against HMF and have selected these for my next order.
Anyone have feelings about these roses?
Dusky Maiden, floribunda
Karen Poulsen, floribunda
Lilac Dawn, floribunda
Minuette, floribunda
Pinocchio, floribunda
Valentine, floribunda
Spartan , floribunda
Schleswig 87, floribunda
Little White Pet, polyantha
Marie Pavie, polyantha
Yvonne Rabier, polyantha
That depends upon the reasons you’re wanting them. As museum pieces, great! For breeding…well…
Pinocchio and Spartan have donated their genes to so much better plants down the line you should go with those plants instead.
Marie Pavie and Yvonne Rabier are the only two I would probably attempt using. But I would have to study them some more.
Thanks Kim:
I was hoping I wasn’t barking up the wrong tree on these. I was looking at the disease resistance and fragrance that HMF has listed for most of these. I did notice that many did not have many if any kids listed, so I guess there’s a reason. On the other hand, nothing ventured, nothing gained. Can obe ever have too many roses?
By the way, most of that bunch you sent back in January are starting to have some bud break. I don’t know about roots yet, but things are looking good. My wife keeps bugging about Silver Moon. She loves things with a great story behind them.
Thanks Adam. I appreciate the input.