Morning all, I was just wondering if anyone out there has used Kronenbourg ( Flaming Peace). If so, how strong is the trait of the light yellow on the reverse of the petals, is it picked up easily by the offspring?. All my breeding in the next couple of years will be about colour and trying to create different colour combinations. I feel a bloom with a distinct colour blend within the petals and those exhibiting different colour to the reverse of the petals gives another colour dimension which will make it special.
Meilland has come out with several roses in recent history that have a stronger-toned reverse. All of them descend from Peace, of course. I am currently using Estelle, but I am unsure as to how strongly the reverse passes on since I am waiting for it’s seeds to germinate.
Warren,
Ketchup & Mustard is a bicolored floribunda and is supposed to be thornless, I am thinking of getting it because of the strong bicolor combinatio and the thornlessness, though it is a bit flashy for me, LOL, though I do like bicolors and blends. The colors appear very strong. It is new and don’t know if it would be available in Australia. It appears to be a dark red on the inside or upper side of the petals and a deep golden yellow on the lower or outer side. Supposed to be healthy as well.
Jim P
Ketchup & Mustard…LOOOVE that name, Jim!!!
She is definately tomato red Jim , but I don’t think we will get it here for a few years yet. Its grandparent Goldmarie, I really like , I must hunt that one down here in OZ.
Goldmarie is a very good rose in these parts. Ketchup and Mustard should be a pretty good bicolor with Baby Love, Goldmarie and City of San Francisco behind it. I would expect it to have better health than Flaming Peace. I’d also expect it’s color to be significantly more stable than Flaming Peace’s. I grew FP in Newhall, in the mid desert years ago and found it to be quite variable, as were all the earlier red/yellow bicolors. They would give anything from pale cerise with an off white reverse to nearly what the catalogs would show.
Kim I just had a look at a late seedling which I had not planted out untill recently, the cross was (Baronne Ed Rothschild X Spek’s Yellow). Its colour is bright candy pink with light yellow reverse, it is amazing when you have some spare time and have the chance to look around.
Sounds pretty Warren. I’ve always liked odd bicolors. Double Feature is one I found in someone’s garden and succeeded in getting back into trade. Double Feature
Mauve with a yellow reverse thats pretty unusual, I would say it has inherited the yellow reverse from Granada. Interesting combo though.
If it were only possible to stripe it like Granada Sunset. Granada Sunset
You could go two options on the striping, one being white striping giving a more softer look and darker mauve stripe for more contrast. Both options I would like.
Sorry, Ketchup and Mustard is NOT thornless. It’s not overly thorny, either – I would say just average on thorniness. But it certainly should not be sold as a “thornless” rose.
[size=medium]Kathy,
Thanks for the correction on K&M. I got the info from Helpmefindroses,. They do say thornless (or almost) but I don’t consider average as almost. I don’t like to use gloves if at all possible and am tired of getting pricked and the tips of thorns embedded in my skin. I have also gotten warts due to the breaks in the skin from the prickles.
I was going to buy it based on what I had read but now won’t. To tide me over the winter doldrums, I bought some grocery store minis but carefully checked and they are all without prickles both on the canes and the rachis. Thornless has become a HUGE feature in my purchase of roses these days.
Jim[/size]
Amen, Jim! I pruned The #@*! Fairy last week. Hateful thing! I hope it dies so I can put something else there. It’s in a client’s garden and she likes it. No accounting for some people’s tastes. It’s as hatefully prickly (and diseased) as the other “vampire” in these parts, Ballerina.
Hi Kim,
just to confirm, is it this The Fairy which you have found to be very prickly and diseased?
Hi George, yes sir, The Fairy. The mildewy, spotty Fairy. The one covered in my blood, making it look like a scene from The Texas Chainsaw Massacre. The one whose Chihuahua teeth prickles are still embedded in my flesh and finger tips. THAT one.
Hi Kim,
The fact it is notably diseased to that extent over your part of the world saddens me the most!!
It occasionally shows a touch of PM here in my relatively humid climate, and only minimal blackspot infection. Agreed, those prickles ARE painful to be sure!!!
O:(
Kim,
That is one rose that is safe from my itchy fingers taking a cutting in the park near me. I enjoy walking by it, looking, and just keep moving.
Maybe that would be a nice project for Warren to work on along with his other smoothies. The Fairy seems to be tough as nails whereever I have seen it grown but the many prickles amidst the many canes turned me off.
There is a practical reason why I have developed a passion, one might say for smoothies. About 2 years after I got into roses in Virginia, I developed about 5 warts on my hands and had to have them burned off. Til then, I had had only one and at the age of 18; decades earlier!
The rose doesn’t cause the infection with the virus, verruca vulgaris, directly, but the prickles when they break the skin, provide a
“Welcome” doormat for the virus to enter. Afterward, I got them intermittently and still have two I am treating. That and the mini, local, infections that develop when a thorn gets embedded and the body tries to seal it off.
There was a post on Garden Web a very short time ago where the poster’s wife got a prickle in her finger and developed loss of sensation or movement. I believe she was operated on but things are still not back to normal. Lab tests were negative if I recall regarding a bacteria or fungus,.
I know, the answer is gloves and I force myself to wear them at times of major pruning especially but am leaning more to the smoothies more and more to the point where it will affect whether I will purchase a particular cultivar or not.
Sorry for the gory details but we need to keep in mind that prickles can be dangerous. In an old, old, thread on garden web, one female poster was pruning a rather large shrub rose and got impaled, hair and all. She couldn’t move.Luckily her husband heard her screams and had to literally cut her out.
Jim
There are a number of reasons to avoid scratches and punctures from rose prickles, Jim. I have atopic dermatitis, “allergic skin”. My mantra is, “I itch, therefore I am!” Instead of irritation causing a histamine response, resulting in itching and rash, my histamine cells leak naturally, resulting in itching which causes the rashes. “Dermal asthma” as my dermatologist calls it. “Hives for the heck of it” is more like it. Fortunately, being well slathered in moisturizers helps maintain control, but steroidal ointments and creams are frequently necessary to calm down the inflammation. Those result in thinning of the skin, making it more fragile and easily damaged.
Add to that thinning of blood by reduction of cholesterol and triglycerides and you have the perfect scenario for a “blood and guts, Hollywood gore fest”! Before I made the dietary changes to reduce the blood thickness, I’d cut or scratch myself and it would bleed but clot in place. Now, with thinner skin and thinner blood, scratches and cuts can get very scary looking, rather quickly. They stop bleeding properly, but until they do, everyone can see the results very easily. I HAVE noticed many of the roses are looking a whole lot “happier”! Talk about putting your 'blood, sweat and tears" into gardening. “Rose Pruning”, a Wes Craven Production!
Here are a couple of pics of my newly planted bareroot of Ketchup & Mustard – clearly there are thorns:
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