Unidentified white HT-type rose

I have always wondered what the identity of this white rose is. The bush is in an uncle’s garden. I have admired it since I was a boy.

The bush stands about 5 foot high, and has prickly canes and the cane growth is stiff and upright. The leaves are very large.

The flowers have a moderate rose/spice fragrance which is most pleasing.

It sets hips.

I love this rose. I dont know why, maybe because it really makes such a large-flowered ivory statement…the blooms are around 4 inches diameter.

It is a TOUGH rose…reminds me of ‘Queen Elizabeth’ in its toughness, but it is a smaller overall size and much more stiff and upright in growth compared to ‘Queen Elizabeth’.

I am sure it is a “run of the mill” variety for its time, given that it was purchased locally at some department store somewhere around 1970.

The pink tones are photographic artefact…

The true color is ivory white.

Any ideas on its identity?

another shot

another aspect

view of flower from underneath

leaf stalk

large leaves, and quite beautiful

It does look a lot like the White Queen Elizabeth. That dates back to the mid 60’s.

And I can’t imagine anything much more upright than any of the QE’s. But the White Queen E is not quite Ivory, but it

isn’t a nice clean white either.


Jackie, here is the rather shapeless flower when close to fully open. At this stage the flower loses its initial graceful urn shape, like so many of its class.

The anthers are golden, and the central styles are red which is a nice contrast in real life. These pictures are unable to capture the fine balance of the color of light of the real thing!

closer look at the reproductive parts…hard to recapture true color here…the stamens are a golden yellow tone.

I just pulled this flower apart. Petal count was 20 (I have never seen a fuller version of this flower on the bush).

The central petals did show the faintest yellowing in strong morning sunlight, the outer petals had bleached to white. Recent rain had in places browned the outer petals which are of a medium thickness.

I just looked at HMF for White Queen Elizabeth…Some of the pictures show a pinkish tone to the centre of the white flower. I don’t know how accurate those pictures are of white Queen Elizabeth…If they are accurate, then it is not this rose…Also, clearly another person has posted pictures of the pink ‘Queen Elizabeth’ in error as well.

My own guess is ‘Mount Shasta’, a progeny out of Queen Elizabeth.

Link: www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.4403

Mount Shasta and Matterhorn were the first two roses that came to mind when seeing the pic + the date. Who knows for sure, though, with it being Australia.

White Queen Elizabeth is like Iceberg in that it csn be quite light pink in cool weather, but it quickly bleaches to white in the heat and hot sun. Even the Gama Ray induced sport White Queen Dr. Lammerts gave Ralph showed the pink in cool weather. Those ancient Queen Elizabeth plants were enormous!

Thanks all for the feedback.

As nobody did I have to point:

why not consider Frau Karl Druschki. An older rose with surprising petal quality.

Looks a bit like ‘Margaret Merril’ to me.

Hi Pierre… HMF says Frau Karl Druschki is not fragrant. This particular white rose in question, has a very definite spice/rose fragrance. I don’t know how correct HMF is in the case of the description of Frau Karl Druschki, but I assume HMF is fairly accurate most of the time?

Hi Simon. HMF says Margaret Merril was bred several years after this rose was actually purchased (~1970), so it cannot be. Thanks for helping anyway! :0)

I’ll try and get confirmation of what it is next time I visit the rose grower … hopefully it will still have the odd flower to take with me when I visit.