Rose Breeders Direct

Plant Patents
, , , , , , , , , , , ,
1

I’ve been speaking with Jim and with Peter about a service I thought RHA could provide for its members to try and connect members directly with commerical growers/agents/etc and I’ve been thinking about it for a while now. Jim suggested I post here to gauge people’s thoughts and reactions so I thought instead of just posting an elevator pitch I’d go ahead and make a working prototype to show people what I mean.

The prototype can be found here: http://rosebreedersdirect.forumotion.com/

It’s not finished visually but these cosmetic changes can be made at any time easily. The plan is to get a dedicated url as well.

If you click on the above link you will be transported to a portal page that will give you a small amount of information about Rose Breeders Direct. The idea is that each breeder will have their own portfolio onto which they can submit their very best seedlings that they think might have a chance of commercial introduction. This portfolio is visible to only three groups of people; the owner of the portfolio, industry reps who have been invited to view them, and the admin. This means that the general public can view nothing when they arrive at the website and the site is not indexed by search engines.

I have created three demo users and logins for people to try. They are:

Username: Breeder 1 (not case sensitive but note there is a space between the r and 1).

Password: testlogin1

Username: Breeder 2

Password: testlogin2

Username: Industry Rep1

Password: testlogin3

If you login as breeder 1 you will only see breeder 1’s portfolio. You can edit this listing, add to it and add a new listing. You can play with these (you won’t break it) and I can clean it up later on. Images can be added as each member gets a free image hosting account that integrates seamlessly into the portfolio’s operation. A template will be made at a later stage to ensure the integrity of the images and information is sound and there is some kind of consistency between portfolios.

If you login as breeder 2 you will only see breeder 2’s portfolio. Again, you can play around with this and change/add to it.

If you login as Industry Rep1 you will be able to see both breeder 1’s and breeder 2’s portfolio but you will not be able to reply to them. You can, however, contact them directly using the private messaging system.

Setting up a portfolio is not as straight forward as setting up a new forum user account so new registrations need to be approved and a portfolio made for them.

People in the rose industry will be contacted directly with pre-made accounts and logins that they can use straight away. Thet will be set up in the same way as the test industry user has been.

One comment was made that HMF already does something like this. The main difference is that HMF is public and viewable to everyone and so publishing a seedling there may void any patenting opportunities. I also think HMF is more of a database for record keeping whilst RBD is more of a connecting tool to assist amateur breeders to put their best seedlings on display. So many great roses are made by RHA members and it would be good to have somewhere to show them off and get some diversity into commercially available roses as producers with different tastes and directions can choose from a wider array of rose types For instance Mistydowns, here in Australia, focus on OGR and heritage-type roses. This might create an avenue for those who might like to breed these kinds of roses. I have had to ask HMF to delete a some seedlings when agents started sniffing around and shyed away when they saw they had been published already. This was mainly because I didn’t do things in the right order and went ahead and registered a seedling and then entered it on HMF under its registered name so clearly identifying it.

This would be an international service (not limited to RHA members), it is freely hosted so won’t demand any resources from RHA and it is hosted externally to RHA so it won’t make any bandwidth demands on our own servers either. I think it makes perfect sense to run it WITH RHA instead of seperate to it.

So… the questions are… do we need it? Would you use it? Do you think it would work?

2

Outstanding idea and thanks for putting this together.

3

A very intriguing idea and it just might work!

4

I like the idea and will check it out. Thank you.

5

I realised that when I was setting it up I forgot to allow for different countries as I had planned to. Still need to iron the bugs out. This has been fixed. I would also like to add more on the portal page to explain that this is a service provided by RHA but won’t until it gets the green light.

6

I think this is a fantastic idea!!! Run with it Simon!

7

Excellent idea as long as free-independent-egalitarian.

And could be extended to other plants.

8

At the moment there is advertising plugged into it. If it gets the green light then I will buy the removal of ads and buy a domain at the same time.

9

Great idea Simon. Liz

10

Yes, great idea!

11

OK… so it seems people think it’s an OK idea… I’m not ready to take any new sign ups yet because I still need to come up with some kind of portfolio template and develop member policies… such as I think people should sign up with their real, full, names etc. because this is not a discussion forum (you can’t actually see any other breeder’s portfolio… only industry reps and admins/moderators can). People should be encouraged to come here for that. It’s a personal showcase and you are promoting yourself as much as your seedlings. If you have submitted a membership application I will let that sit until I have these other parts up and running. In the mean time you can use the demo users to see the features available.

I’d really like to hear from Jacques, or someone else in the industry, before I start putting together a portfolio template. I’d like to hear about what features they initially look for (first impressions etc) so that these can be worked into the template. Jim said to me that as a whole people in the industry are wary of photos… and rightly so I guess… so the template would need to reflect other traits as well as photos of particular types. I also think it would be good to include a standard means of assessing seedlings that could also be worked into the template.

I’d also like to get some feedback about whether RHA would officially like to offer this service so that I can volunteer to do it as an RHA volunteer instead of a private entity.

Another thing I’d like is a group of regional moderators. These people would moderate their own country’s breeder portfolios and help to compile a list of producers and/or plant agents in their country and be responsible for sending out emails to these people with RBD access details. I’d like to make these people accounts and send them access details instead of leaving them to sign up. It’s easier for them if they are given access straight away and that way the permissions can be set at the same time. These regional moderators don’t necessarily need to be proficient in IT but instead be willing to have a go and learn some basic procedures… it’s not hard. They would also be the person people in their country would contact for assistance in using their portfolios. In my experience the thing people will need the most assistance with is posting images. I have made a video tutorial of how to do this using the free image host account that is integrated into the software. I’ll be making a ‘how to’ section for people and will add it into there as I get things up and running more.

When you sign up there are policies in place that are standard issue with the software and not written by me. These can be adjusted and expanded to include specific details that we want to include once it all has the green light.

Anyway… if you have any ideas what the template for the portfolios should include add them here.

12

If your looking for votes consider mine the first. I’ll vote a few more times if necessary :wink:

13

I’ve added another user for people to play with:

username: breeder 3

password: testlogin3

You can make posts and trial uploading images if you like.

Note so much after votes… More after ideas at the moment. I guess as an association I have to propose a motion… then it needs to be voted on by the membership etc Is that how this needs to be done?

If this is how it’s done I’d like to donate the RBD website and my services to maintain it to RHA and propose the motion to officially recognise RBD as a subsection of RHA and another to recognise the functions of RBD as an official RHA service.

14

[quote=SimonV]

The idea is that each breeder will have their own portfolio onto which they can submit their very best seedlings that they think might have a chance of commercial introduction. This portfolio is visible to only three groups of people; the owner of the portfolio, industry reps who have been invited to view them, and the admin. This means that the general public can view nothing when they arrive at the website and the site is not indexed by search engines.

This would be an international service (not limited to RHA members), it is freely hosted so won’t demand any resources from RHA and it is hosted externally to RHA so it won’t make any bandwidth demands on our own servers either. I think it makes perfect sense to run it WITH RHA instead of seperate to it.

So… the questions are… do we need it? Would you use it? Do you think it would work?[/quote]

I love the idea, and I think it should be done. But I’m going to play devil’s advocate on a few points: Trying to think from the perspective of the industry representative… If this is entirely free to anyone to self-report on the virtues of a seedling represented in a glamour shot, is there a risk that this will become a smorgasborg of everyone’s pretty seedling with no real meaning behind the reports? Would you be willing to consider linking this to some meaningful rose trialing/assessment system, or something to put a little meat behind it?

I realize that some trialing exists through the RHA, but Shreveport is not a great place to test a Canadian rose, and…

I’m not being critical – I love this – but I’m wondering if it could become something more powerful. I worry that it could be a little too democratic, to the point of limiting its own merits, if that makes sense. Maybe there could be a link to “sponsors” or third parties that can vouch for a rose or a breeder’s worthiness? I dunno… Thoughts?

15

Hi Phillip… I agree… that’s what I meant when I said this above:

[quote=SimonV]

I’d really like to hear from Jacques, or someone else in the industry, before I start putting together a portfolio template. I’d like to hear about what features they initially look for (first impressions etc) so that these can be worked into the template. Jim said to me that as a whole people in the industry are wary of photos… and rightly so I guess… so the template would need to reflect other traits as well as photos of particular types. I also think it would be good to include a standard means of assessing seedlings that could also be worked into the template.

Anyway… if you have any ideas what the template for the portfolios should include add them here.[/quote]

It’s also why I haven’t thrown it open to everyone straight away because this particular aspect it needs to begivenmore thought. I think by standardising the seedling evaluation in some way it can avoid devaluing it to some extent.

16

Thanks, yes. I apologize, you did address exactly that. I guess I didn’t read very carefully.

A couple times I tried to reincarnate an old thread I had about creating meaningful regional rose trials in the U.S. I had begun it prior to the AARS’s issues, and tried to bring it up again when they were having their problems. (As I said at the time, nobody lives in “All America” and I don’t give a hoot about an “All American” rose. I want a rose appropriate for my garden.) I felt something like that might actually be more meaningful for industry reps and breeders to share and connect. But I wonder if such could work in tandem with your very excellent idea.

I love that you have moved forward with your idea, and hope it will get traction.

Would there be reason to link with the World Federation of Rose Societies? They might have connections to national trials, but I honestly know nothing of their organization.

http://www.worldrose.org/trials/2012/trials00-2012.asp

17

I think between us something that is flexible enough to cater for the vagaries of our differing climates, but descriptive enough to give a good impression of a seedling, can be developed here. I don’t think it needs to be absolutely prescriptive because as you say a one-size-fits-all approach isn’t going work. I think in needs to include progressional data by way of whole plant photos at different stages of the year for example and evaluations by more than one person in different areas. I think it needs to be made a little difficult to meet the criteria to add seedlings to a breeder’s portfolio so that only the best are listed. Producers are going to want to conduct their own trials anyway but it would be nice to try and give them the essence of what they are looking for in an easy to read manner.

I was thinking this evaluation sheet might be adapted somehow to do the job:

[attachment 1394 AssessmentSheet.pdf]

18

Who typically sponsors a cultivar at a nationally recognized trial? Is it more commonly the breeder, or the industry representative? — I guess I’m wondering who is the chicken and who is the egg in the marketing chain… err… to mix my expressions…

(The chicken crossed the road because it was chained to the egg??? I hope I’m making more sense to someone else than I am to myself right now.)

19

[quote=Philip_LA]

Who typically sponsors a cultivar at a nationally recognized trial? Is it more commonly the breeder, or the industry representative? [/quote]

Philip here in OZ the grower can submit his own cultivar or the grower can do it in their own interest.

20

Sorry… I’m away at the moment in Sydney… be back on Monday