Hi Henry. You mean it can give both diploid (2n) as well as 1n pollen, yes?
Anyway, I want the babies to be only diploids in the particular line I want to experiment with, so I am after a diploid mini for that purpose to use on another diploid.
George, yes, both diploid (2n) as well as (1n) pollen,.
You could try filtering the pollen. A normal gasoline filter is about the correct size.
I see.
Also, I suppose there is no ‘guarantee’ expecting that all the 2n x 2n crosses will turn out as 2n babies. Occasional 3n babies could also result due to unreduced egg gametes anyway, as Murphy’s law would have it!
Once you have the plant, you can check the diameter of its pollen to get a “estimate” of its “ploid”. If you see both larger and smaller pollen, it is probably a triploid.
Can I do this with ordinary light microcopy, Henry?
There are many diploid polyanthas and ones that somehow got filtered into the miniature category you may enjoy working with like ‘Sweet Chariot’ and ‘Gormet Popcorn’.
George, concerning the use of a light microscope, see:
http://www.rosehybridizers.org/forum/search.php?searchFor=microscope&searchMsgs=Search
Link: www.rosehybridizers.org/forum/search.php?searchFor=microscope&searchMsgs=Search
Simon, thanks also for your tip on the nursery Thomas For Roses…I just emailed them, asking them if they have ‘Oakington Ruby’ (as per Paul Barden) and/or’Rouletii’…fingers crossed.
Hi David. ‘Sweet Chariot’ has as its seed parent ‘Little Cheif’…Is it correct to assume that Little Chief is also a confirmed diploid?
David Zlesak, I can obtain a ‘Gourmet Popcorn’ plant. Could you, or others here, who may grow it, please rate its blackspot propensity compared to the average mini (in your particular climates)?
Gourmet Popcorn is extremely healthy here. If it does BS, it covers it up with new growth. It did not bs for me with no spray when I kept it trimmed down each winter. When I would let it get way bigger (it can form a 5’ ball – no joke) then what I could see was bs free but idea about what the center looks like lol.
By the way, the only thing mini about Gourmet Popcorn here is the name lol… I could have been just as easily labeled a polyantha or shrub if it were not for the tell-tale signs of miniature genetics in the leaves.
By the way, Gourmet Popcorn is the best white landscape rose I have even seen. There is like 50 at a yuppy strip mall near me. They always look nice and in bloom during the growing season.
This sounds very encouraging Jadae. Hopefully it has some fertility both ways. This could be one little problem solved for me in my current search for a clean mini diploid, to start off a line of breeding…at least one I can get here without quarantine stuff to worry about…so little time…
It is highly infertile both ways. It can be fertile sometimes, though. Of the bajillion blooms it spends in a year, it will give like a dozen OP hips lol.
I see…I wonder why David Zlesak listed it (see further up in this thread) as a diploid worthy of trying out?
Many diploid roses necessitate compatible foreign pollen in order to set hips i.e. The Fairy that often does not may be as fertile as any given compatible pollen.
Now that it interesting to hear Pierre.
Possibly then it is worth throwing a variety of diploid pollens onto ‘Gourmet Popcorn’ with a percentage of successful takes not out of the question?
If not afraid of raising a lot of seedling you can grow side by side one or more (large enough to get simultaneous flowerings) diploids and rely on bee pollination. Most viable seeds will be crossed and all diploid. And miniature being dominant you will get many.
If I remember well (I cannot go to HMF that actually does not load for me…) this was done repeatedly in the breeding of Sea Foam.
Applying foreign pollen on non emasculated flowers is an option.
Thank you Pierre, for your interesting advice. I will follow your advice, and report outcomes in a few months time. Next step = off to the nursery!