I love this rose insanely - has anyone much experience of using it in hybridising? Hints and tips welcome, please
I used it a couple of years ago and got about 300 seedlings with various pollen parents. I did not use its pollen on anything. I have a couple of very nice seedlings from it that I kept and am using them this year in my hybridizing program. I did not do anything special as far as germination goes. I think I was lucky or the weather was right or something because I had some OP hips/seeds from it last year and had 0 germinations. You have to realize the seeds have 21 chromsomes and the pollen only 7 so if you use R. Glauca as a seed parent you will not get very much of the pollen parent you use on it and may be hard to determine if it is actually a hybrid or not. I have determined that these two which I have are hybrids by seeing some traits of the pollen parents in them. I threw the rest away because I could not determine for sure if they were hybrids. Good luck
Patrick
My experience with it is similar to Patrick
(R.blanda x R.arkansana) x glauca !!!
How is fertility??
According to Hurst’s Septet Formulae
R.Blanda X R. Arkansana would give you a triploid offspring. R. Glauca with a (3+1) config ,as a pollinator, crossed with the offspring of the R.B and R.A , you would still end up with a triploid. Fertility could be iffy but I would try it both ways to determine where the fertility lies and then GO FOR IT.lol
cheers Warren
I did a bunch of crosses with R. glauca x different sorts of pollen not last year but the year before. I probably did 150 to 200 crosses getting what seemed to be a 40% take rate. Mostly using diploid but a few tetraploid and one triploid. It only took one of the tetraploid pollen if I remember right, but it seemed to take a lot of the diploid. But when I grew them out most seemed like pure R. glauca. But their were a few that have not bloomed that differ in leaf morphology, thorn morphology, and intensity of the leaf color (on the last one combine this with other traits because some may have lower intensity but are otherwise pure R. glauca) that are most likely hybrids. But I have yet to see them bloom.
One important thing I notice is that leaf color at least under lights did not develop well until they were brought outside. Another thing is the seed seemed to germinate better when I did two weeks in the fridge two weeks out and kept on doing that. Also make sure your plant ties are on well since the hips are usually pretty small. I lost most of mine in the fall winds. (and would you know it all the seedlings showing signs of being crosses are from these tagless hips. I know what I used on it but that only narrows it down to 20 or so pollen parents.)
I did get the pollen to take on Little White Lies but I do not think the seed grew or if it did grow they did not get past the cotyledon stage. I am going to try its pollen on some rugosas this year.
One last not the seedling I had with the best leaf color that year was from Little White Lies(bad parent) x R. woodsii. This seedling had light green foliage on top and dark redish purple foliage on bottom. Too bad it hung around with the wrong crowd. Powdery Mildew. At times It looked like Christmas. Green, Red and a lot of white snow.
I
I have a repeat blooming hybrid of R. glauca, maybe a descendant of Carmenetta, that has been referred to as ‘Skinner’s Red Leaf Perpetual’ on this forum. It has put out some suckers last season and I would be willing to part with some if anyone is interested. It set OP hips for me last season and when used in a cross as well. All seeds have yet to germinate.
Hugh Skinner ( son of Frank Skinner) has given approval to the name ‘Skinner’s Redleaf Perpetual’ (my suggestion).
Excerpts from Robert Simonet’s letters to Percy Wright.
November 13/1961
“Yesterday I noticed in my rose patch a bush labelled (rubrifolia x altaica) x Harisons Yellow. It has set hips and there is little doubt that the foregoing is the true parentage. Two other plants are (rubrifolia x altaica) x laxa and (rubrifolia x altaica) x (Alika x Laxa). Both have single flowers like rubrifolia but larger.”
July 8/1966
Rosa rubrifolia hybrids
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Carmenetta seedling.
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Rosa rubrifolia x Mrs. Anthony Waterer - small, semi-double flowers.
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Rosa rubrifolia hybrid with Altaica and Laxa in parentage. “Flowers slightly larger than previous and only slightly fertile as a female parent.”
Note: It is very possible the ‘Carmenetta’ seedling is ‘Skinners Redleaf Perpetual’. Robert Simonet and Frank Skinner sometimes exchanged rose material. Also, the ‘Mrs. Anthony Waterer’ distributed among Canadian Prairie rose breeders at this time was mislabeled. The shrub labeled this cultivar was a pure Rugosa cultivar with semi-double, purple-red flowers.
For rose breeders not familiar with Robert Simonet (1903 - 1988), he lived in Edmonton, Alberta. I consider him the most imaginative of all Canadian rose breeders. It was his ‘Red Dawn’ x ‘Suzanne’ selection that made possible the development of nearly all Dr. Felicitas Svejda’s Rosa kordesii Explorer cultivars. I was fortunate to have known and worked with him (although at the time (late 70’s) I was more interested in fruit culture than roses).
update: I have had germination from Skinner’s Red Leaf Perpetual.
As a matter of curiosity, when doing crosses with R.glauca, how difficult is it to obtain remontancy? And is there a specific gamete (male of female) which carries the genome for or against such? Or is it more a case of statistical odds? For instance, is it a given that the potential will only exist with the cross going one way, but not the other? (Okay, so plants don’t have genes attached to x or y chromosomes, but I don’t know if there is still some gamete association in Caninae…) Or rather, if using the R.g. seed with i.e. pollen from a china (i.e. diploid) rose, are the odds of a remontant gene existing in offspring simply statistically less than, say, using R. glauca pollen on a china?
I would love to see the foliage color expressed in a remontant offspring and assume that would take a second crossing, but wonder if specific genes in caninae will go one direction or the other in the F1 crossing.
Pardon my mutilating what little I’ve retained of my high-school genetics. I hope my question makes sense.
Paul,
Are you growing ‘Skinner’s Redleaf Perpetual’ and if so, has it repeat bloomed for you? I’m still waiting for mine to repeat bloom. Does plant maturity have something to do with it?
Rob
You have to realize the seeds have 21 chromsomes and the pollen only 7
Dredging up the past a bit… I have only ever seen glauca referenced as being tetraploid where both pollen and ovules have a haploid number of 14. Which is right ?