Paring Down the List

General Discussion
1

BTW, I also posted this message to Rosarian’s Corner. I want as much input as possible. If you read both lists,

I apologize:

I’ve been going through catalogs. And my list of

wants is way too large and I need to pare it down.

So I could use some help. I’m interested in breeding

unusual color breaks/stripes, w/ high disease resistance,

I also am interested in breeding high petal count/OGR type

flowers in bright clean colors (and again disease resistant)

Fragrance is important as well. I also want to cross

reblooming OGR w/ the newer disease resistant varieties.

(All my rose goals include high repeat bloom).

My list of roses I currently have:

Angel Face FL 1968

Betty Boop Floribunda 1999

Dolly Parton HT 1984

Double Delight HT 1977

Fragrant Cloud HT 1967

Gina Lollibrigida HT 1997

Gold Medal Grandiflora 1982

Graham Thomas SHRUB DA 1983

Gruss an Aachen HT 1909

Gypsy Carnival Grandiflora 1986

Iceberg Floribunda 1958

Joseph’s Coat Climber 1956

La Reine Victoria Bourbon 1872

Mme. Isaac Periere Bourbon 1889

Midas Touch HT 1992

Mister Lincoln HT 1964

New Dawn Climber 1930

New Zealand HT 1989

Othello SHRUB DA 1986

Party Time HT 1986

Paul Neyron H. Perpetual 1869

Peace HT 1945

Queen Elizabeth GF 1954

Reine des Violettes H. Perpetual 1860

R. rugosa ‘Scabrosa’ H. rugosa SHRUB 1950

Scentimental Floribunda 1997

Sharifa Asma SHRUB DA 1989

The McCartney Rose HT 1995

Therese Bugnet h. rugosa SHRUB 1950

Zephirine Druhin Bourbon 1868

And of course the catalogs don’t generally say whether a

rose is a good parent.

My list of Wants:

For disease resistance

Barn Dance

Carefree Beauty

Earth Song

Prairie Harvest

Livin’ Easy

Easy Going

Morning Has Broken (also falls under bright color)

Mermaid (is this fertile?)

Westerland

Autumn Sunset

Baby Love (plus bright color)

Bonica

Knockout

Dortmund (I understand this must be deadheaded to

encourage rebloom - Would Henry Kelsey be a better choice?)

For Unusual Color/Bright/combinations

Blue Skies

Distant Drums

Distant Thunder

Deep Secret (plus disease resistance/Frangrance)

Just Joey (plus fragrance)

Autumn Splendor

Oranges ‘n’ Lemons

Outa the Blue

Playboy

Tequila Sunrise

Incognito

Pristine

For Fragrance

Fragrant Masterpiece

Magnificent Perfume

Eiffel Tower

Sheila’s Perfume

Velvet Fragrance

Barbara Streisand

Fragrant Plum

French Perfume

OGR

Frau Karl Druschki

Souv. de la Malmaison

Souv. du Dr. Jamain

High Petal Count

Louise Clements [unusual color as well]

Golden Celebration

Jude the Obscure

William Shakespeare

Amazing Grace

The Fawn

Size

Brother Cadfael (size of flower [ok, I like the Brother Cadfael mysteries as well])

Happy Child (size of the shrub and color)

Pretty Jessica (size of the shrub)

Tamora

Mossed Roses

Scarlet Moss

Danny Boy

Rugosa

Hansa

Fru Dagmar Hastrup

Polyantha

The Fairy

Cecile Brunner

Doesn’t fit a cateory exactly

Pink above all (Small rosebud type flowers)

Lyda Rose (look like apple blossoms)

Please pare away!

2

Since you asked to pare down your list, here are some that have had very low feritility for me: Double Delight, Reine des Violettes, Mermaid, Knock Out, and Just Joey. Some that work better as pollen parent than seed parent: Gold Medal, New Zealand, and Scentimental.

3

“You can’t always get what you want” - The Rolling Stones

Chris, for an amateur breeder working with HT’s and Floribundas it is very difficult to obtain selections with high disease resistance. You have to work on a very large scale to do that, especiallly to have a combination of disease resistance, fragrance and “high repeat bloom” that you want. My suggestion is to work with Rosa kordesii cultivars like ‘Dortmund’ to obtain disease resistance, keeping in mind that you are not likely to obtain very fragrant selections. But if you don’t have disease resistance, the rest doesn’t matter. For a goal of disease resistance and clean colour, you might want to try ‘Living Easy’ x ‘Dortmund’. For combining disease resistance and unusual colur breaks, ‘Playboy’ x ‘Dortmund’/‘Park Director Riggers’ should have potential. 'Dortmund is more disease resistant than ‘Henry Kelsey’ but is not as hardy, so be aware of that.

4

Speaking of Livin’ Easy-- Jim sent me a pic of one of the Livin’ Easy X R. kordesii seedlings. This is the very first time I have seen a flower bloom from this cross because all of my seedlings were eaten by slugs.

But I’m a bit sad that it has the magenta color, and hasn’t any yellow or orange tones. Maybe if it was crossed with Arthur Bell, or Chinatown, or Baby Love, it could bring in yellow and disease resistance.

Link: forums.gardenweb.com/forums/rosesgal/msg1223595020675.jpg

5

Chris

A rose not on your list which I really love is Fourth of July. It’s virtues are color & stripes, fertility both ways (lots of pollen) health & it will bloom off new wood, and will bloom low on the plant if you get dieback in winter. Mine is a body bagged J&P on tender roots from Home Depot, but it has survived and flourished in really crummy weather. It has a Delbard & a Moore mini in its ancestry. I don’t remember it having any fragrance, but you can make up for that in the other rose. The op roses I got from it have been shrubby & basal branching, survived winter as 1st year seedlings & are still going. I used it on Bonica & got stripes. The other seedlings are dark red.

As for Henry Kelsey,it’s fertile both ways & stangely, it’s the healthiest rose in my garden. I guess it all depends on the strain of blackspot in your own region. It’s op seedlings are very thorny. I’m beginning to use it on everything.

6

Chris

Here’s my two cents worth.

From my experience here’s a few I found with low fertility. Oranges n Lemons, William Shakespeare, Gruss an Aachen, Zephirine Druhin , Reine des Violettes, and Distant Drums. I also wouldn’t worry about adding any more “fragant roses” to your collection. I think you got a reasonable mix from your existing roses. Also I’m not sure if getting both Autumn Sunset and Westerland gets you anything, since one is a color sport. Same applies to Easy Going and Livin’ Easy.

One I would add is Lillian Austin I found it to be quite fertile and has good disease resistance and as a plus it can pass on good fragrance.