‘Si’!!! I was just thinking the other day that if I was going to spend the money on importing any rose from the U.S. it would be ‘Si’… I just love it. Paul says it’s sterile… I think, however, I would still try and try and try every year if I could. ‘Si’ was the first rose I ever grew at a young age of 10 
My recollections of it are that it actually had lots of stamens but I lost it around 20 years ago and my memory of it is fading. I have never seen it here since and I fear it is lost in Australia. And… reminding me of ‘Petite Perle d’Or’ is good too… must get both ‘Cindarella’ and ‘Perle d’Or’… I had a ‘blonde’ moment last year when making my orders… I ordered ‘Reve d’Or’ when I meant to order ‘Perle d’Or’. d’Or well… is all good… I wanted ‘Reve d’Or’ as a breeder as well… I have hips forming on Rosa longicuspis var. sinowilsonii with ‘Reve d’Or’ now too
I wonder how hard it is for us hobbyists to import budwood or plants from the U’S??? Maybe I could get a group of us together to spread the costs.
Simon, no one has used this one, and it is a love! Laurie Chaffin, who owned the nursery Pixie Treasures with her mother “Dottie Louise”, said Gene Strawn made some great roses. This one is as clean as any and blooms like a weed. I think you’ll enjoy the story in the comments section how it was named. Yup, that was Dorothy! LOL! Kim
Link: www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.40045
Good story indeed!
When I was 10 we moved from Sydney up towards Newcastle in NSW onto a rural property. We lived in my grandparent’s house in the country until our house was built. The neighbouring farm had a fenced house yard and the old couple that lived there had a jungle of all kinds of interesting plants in it. Seeing as my grandparents were nursery people I had an interest in plants at that stage, the old lady, whose name was Bid Smith (the husband use to scare the pants off me… old George was a bad tempered old coot… I was sweet on one of his grand daughters… didn’t even stand a chance LOL), use to take me around and give me pieces of this and that and I’d taken them into my grandparents tunnel houses and try to grow them… she gave me cuttings of this tiny tiny pink rose and they grew and I took them with me everywhere I went for the next 10-15 years. I didn’t know what it was called then and used to affectionately call it ‘Biddy Smith’. I lost it in one of my moves (it’s taken me 35 years to find somewhere I want to put down my own roots) and the old couple died and the new owners of the farm levelled the jungle garden and I’ve never seen it again since.
About 10 years ago I realised the little rose was ‘Si’ and I’ve been looking for it ever since. People have sent me things they thought were ‘Si’ but none of them have ever turned out to be it unfortunately. That’s how I got into roses 30 years ago… and I’ve been infected with RMV (Rose Mad Virus) ever since
Simon and Kim,
Lovely stories both of them; thanks (my Bedtime stories for the night). Like your definition of RMV- I wonder if Heat Treatment would help us!
JIm1
Max, how young were you when you started (growing, hybridizing, anything, etc)? One of my original goals was to win the PRS Spring Show Queen just to see some faces turn hate red followed by rage white. I did that when I won the Tualitin Valley Perpetual Trophy at age 18. I do not think there is a feeling in the world to convey what it feels like for someone of your opposite gender and quadruple your age to have animosity towards you for winning a trophy with flowers… lol. Hopefully I saved some of them from cardiac arrest (some of them actually worried me because of the level of anger + anxiety exhibited during shows) when I quit exhibiting at 24ish. If I was to name names, which I will not, some of you would be surprised that they could exhibit some really nasty negative behaviors. Some of you would recognize the names instantly. I actually found it to be dishonorable to one of our national symbols, as well as just gross, but whatever. Its definitely a very different world doing this sort of world when starting young. Its definitely one of those experiences not easily translatable.
ps. I have “big” (yuck yuck yuck…) plans with Petite Perle d’Or. Wish me luck on finding pollen without doing a face plant
HATE RED, RAGE WHITE- I can well believe that. When I was in my mid twenties, I went to a dahlia show with my mother and younger sister. I remember overhearing one of the exhibitors giving one of the judges holy hell about something and I said to myself, “If exhibiting (competing ) will turn my love of gardening into that , I want no part of it.” That is about the only resolution I think I have ever kept. Congrats on the win Jad- yes, age does not automatically confer wisdom or class (grace under pressure LOL)-I can vow for that. Because of what I personally saw and overheard, I am not at all surprised. The library where I volunteer acquired the book"Otherwise Normal." It is all about rose exhibitors and their passion for exhibiting (competing anyone?) Actually I found it rather humorous. I love rose exhibitions but can do with leaving the competition out.
Jim
I found it rather depressing at such a young age. I expected better of my “elders”. It was the naive question of, “I know right from wrong. Why dont they?” I still do not actually get it. I get why people act the way they do but I still do not get the need to compete in such hostile terms when the entire point of a rose show is to show the common public roses. The point is to entice the public to also grow roses! I have always been attempted to apply design theory to construct a goal-oriented program to a rose show to display the fallicies that currently take place. (examples: limiting varieties displayed due to subjective constraints, limiting those that can grow said rose, displaying disgraceful behaviors while representing a national symbol, etc). It’d be pointless but it’d be pretty funny, lol.
What is funny is that I really have no clue why I exhibited starting at 12 or so, other than it was this unusual world I was intrigued by. I remember loving COLOR though. I thought the crystal and silver was tacky, even at that age, but I thought the ribbons were cool. I was more interested in collecting every colored ribbon possible. Some of them were even giant rainbows. I believe I began because it was both an escape and an extension of the outdoor world I was attracted to already, but I never really exhibited to win for the sake of winning. I never understood the point. I would bring roses like Freedom to shows, knowing it had “perfect” form but would lose regardless because it was too small. I’d watch people comment on its beauty though, which is what made me happy. I wanted others to see that there are many worlds out there. I still do, and I think people have the right to bring those worlds to their homes as long as its ethical. That is actually how I always trained my crews. “Would you want THAT in your yard? I didnt think so.” I have always believed that the end goal was to give others a joy they would not have otherwise experienced in life. And I am sure others here have different reasons they have engaged the world of roses. I am sure it is different than those that may be pure exhibitors, although I know there is some cross-over. To those of you that do cross-over – PLEASE No more pink blends!!! lol…
Also, all my silver trophies went to Goodwill years ago. Tarnish is not a gift, lol. My German-forged stainless steel sporks are prettier 
The little experience I had with roses shows was similar.
Exhibiting for competition can and does turn otherwise rational gardeners into something I care not to be associated with.
Competition personality types tend to vie for leadership positions which perpetuates and facilitates competition events and competition mentality.
Manic irresponsible use of pesticides, fertilizers, pruning and conveniently short memories are often part of the equation.
It’s the primary reason I abandoned ARS membership and the local rose society.
Similarly, I decided AARS designations were pretty much a farce years ago.
On an otherwise level playing field, final designation seems to boil down to partisan politics amongst a very few key players.
The truth is results may vary depending on a myriad of factors like personal preference, location, and cultural conditions.
In short, you better do your research and if it’s a rose show, watch your back.
Are you saying to not pick up the soap? LOL! I fully agree with all of your reasons to resist engaging in the activity. My main issue, personally, is that it is just TOO much unnecessary work. Growing anything is enough effort. Preparing the site, especially on a hill with native under brush, protecting from marauding varmints and PEOPLE, then just keeping them happy and productive without resorting to the world of chemicals and obsessive routines is difficult enough. Who in their ever loving right mind WANTS to get up before the crack of crack, slosh outside to do anything by flashlight then work like a dog before driving to the ends of the earth and start that insanity all over again. There is no wonder so much bad behavior is exhibited!
Work the Wasco harvest if you want cold, dark, wet work! THAT was at least interesting and even fun. No thanks, being an exhibitionist is just too freaking much work! IF it was to actually promote the rose and the enjoyment of GARDENING or breeding, that would be one thing. But to do it simply to promote your “virility” is just dumb IMHO. Kim
Hi Kim,
That is part of what I mean. ie. How does that translate to the weekend warrior? It doesnt because they have real lives, which completely nullifies the intended goal of a rose show, LOL.
Any wonder why 99% of American exhibitionists are circling the drain? Think “Waiting for God”. Kim
A few years back an acquaintance from a neighboring rose society relayed a recent experience he had with a group from another state where he regularly exhibited his roses. This guy really went all out to win prizes, and his roses were indeed spectacular. (I am totally NOT interested in the prize competition mentality, but if someone else is, I’m not going to discourage them: do what makes you happy) The last time he took his roses to this out-of-state show, he won a half dozen prizes, mostly “big’uns”, and the “personalities” in charge of the show confronted him and asked him not to attend their show anymore because he was snatching all the best prizes!
I cannot find the words to describe how I feel about such appalling behavior from so-called “adults” who are supposedly there to “educate the public about roses”. Some education!
This is what comes to mind when I think of the ARS.
Hey, there have been murders over giant leeks in the UK. There is a primitive tribalism featuring totally obsessive men (just about always, clearly something weirdly phallic going on a lot of the time). A terrifying world. Jadae, what you described seems so mean-spirited and spiteful - I actually thought generosity was a condition of being a decent gardener.
Thats part of the problem. Theyre not gardeners. Theyre calculators of facts. The lack of connection between self and land is missing.
That’s the difference. “Gardeners” are altruistic, good stewards of their plants and resources, always willing to share what they have and know. Gardeners do what they do for the love of the plants and the “doing it” with very little, if any, ego involved, not self promotion. “Exhibitionists” self promote. Bruised egos cause the bad behavior.
Jadae, my family has always had a vegetable and flower garden of some sort. It wasn’t until I was fourteen that I got really interested in plants. I read and read and read and planted plants in our yard and in 2007 I started working at a local nursery helping in the plant and perennial departments. I help people pick out the right plants, answer questions and also help people design, actually my favorite part is design. I don’t trust many homeowners with good design aesthetics, it’s unfortunate but many have no idea what to do so I LOVE teaching people how to make things look good and make an interesting garden. I landscaped my cousin’s front yard and am planning to do her backyard too! Roses interested me at age fifteen I think, around 2004, 2005 when I planted ‘Roseraie de L’Hay’. We’re lucky our property was an old “farmette” kind of place, so I have two acres to play on. I feel like I could have started crossing earlier, but at 21 I feel I know more about roses than even I did two years ago, I feel I can do a much better job. Unfortunately I think because of my age people at the nursery are often impressed with how much I know about stuff, but outside the nursery because of no formal training, I find I am looked down upon because of my age. Considering applying to become a master gardener, that might help with things…
It kills me though you cannot get good roses like ‘Earthsong’ or even ‘Roseraie de L’Hay’ here in gallon containers. Here at our nursery, aside from Knockouts, Austins and Flower Carpet roses, our nursery only carries flordibundas and hybrid teas/grandflorias that all are probably killed by those who buy them and the oldest they sell would probably be 'Z
Max, I’m in Tasmania, Australia. I don’t spray any of my minis. I don’t spray anything except my seedlings actually 
There are very few minis that actually do really well here. There survive and flower but they are not very healthy really for a no-spray garden. It’s a goal to try and turn this around here.
Max,
You should learn how to root rose cuttings. Since you are a student and money is tight, it is a great way to save and yet enlarge your collection and you will have learned a new skill. There are some fine rose gardeners in Maryland whom I am sure would be happy to give you some rose cuttings. I am sure you probably know some of them from Garden Web.
When I first joined the local rose society, one of the members gave us a talk on how to root roses at his house and then told us to take some cuttings from his garden. I was very successful. After that I would go to his house every fall and take a few cuttings each year. I am sure half of my collection started from his garden. In later years I was able to repay him by giving him cuttings or plants of roses he did not have. Yes, I had bought some over the years also.
I presently live in Richmond, Va. Your climate is very similar. If you would like a copy of the rooting method, send me an email. I tried the baggy method but always failed, totally. I am still working out my seed germination skills and have yet to find a successful way.
When I feel more confident in my method, I shall try some hybridizing. Right now, I am still practicing with OPs.
Jim
jprov at comcast dot net
Yeah, like racism, age discrimination is also absolute. Discriminaiton is discrimination no matter how ya cut it. We hear about age discrimination for those near or above retirement age, but we never hear about youth/teens/tweens being side stepped because of their age despite their actual ability, skill, or knowledge.
I actually find the way retail nurseries sell roses to be inefficient, especially if all theyre going for is amendment sales. I think all the jumbo-sized pots are unneccessary, as well as the narrow selections. I would hope that the future brings about a vision of the tall, linear tree pots filled with own-root roses. I do find it annoying that everything is Knock Out because of the reduced selection, but I am happy it exists because it shows that own-root, smaller pot sizes can be more profitable and more efficient. I’d love to see own-root roses in something like a 2G Tall, similar to what a 2g Tree liner looks like – but more stable in physics. 3G Tall boys exist in rounds. We used them for random plants like Hydrangea ‘Limelight’ etc. They could also work well, but I am not so sure most own-roots need that much space. I could see that as working for an own-root climber or shrub type though.
I hope you can see Heirlooms some day so you can see why they are so successful. It is the display gardens that really retain anyone’s heart that visits there. It shows them via all senses what roses can do. So people then are more likely to step out of the traditional mold and experience variety.
I like Double Red Knock Out. I think all the others are ugly, but Double Red is sufficienty aesthetic and healthy. The original may be the healthiest but all the women in the office LOVED Doube Red. They thought it was the most romantic thing ever – and it barely even smells lol.
That’s way too funny that the women in the office thought Dbl Red Knock Out romantic. Studies have long shown MEN find red stimulating while women traditionally go for apricot, peach and yellow. It’s the market that has taught us all that women LOVE red roses. My middle sister likes roses as garden plants, but she LOVES gladiolus and carnations as cut flowers and always in bright, spring like colors. The youngest one is allergic to air so when brought flowers, she weakly smiles, then hands them off to anyone who will take them. She is honestly allergic to any kind of fur and pollen. She dated a guy who just didn’t get it. Their first date, he bought her an angora sweater. The second, a rabbit jacket. She told him he was going to fast and being to extravagant. That didn’t sink in, so she asked him if he was trying to kill her! Both gifts caused her to swell up and have to start hitting the Benedryl! LOL!