Has ‘St Patrick’ ever set seed for anyone here (either OP or as a deliberate cross)?
If I was to approach this trainwreck (seriously! Use MM instead!!!), I’d strip the majority of the petals off early to reduce the humidity at the core, and then I’d emasculate as soon as it was logistically possible without plant injury. The problem with roses like St. Patrick is that the petals are such sheilds that they create a different internal environment for the reproductive parts. Pollen is obviously easier.
Hi Michael,
I did purchase 2 MM, but it just doesn’t grab me like St P does.
Both MM and ST P suffer real bad from black spot here, currently MM is doing worse than ST P in terms of defoliation (~50% MM vs ~20% St P).
I am a sucker for St P… maybe its too bad for me, but it is fact!!!
Anyways, I can’t see it making OP hips…I thought to try for fun, I’ll follow what you say, but maybe I shouldn’t emasculate it if it doesn’t set OP hips??
P.S
I tried MM with Euphrates pollen several times—> zero result.
Correct, but MM is by far superior as a plant and can pass on the same chlorophyll, as well as odd tone of yellow. Its not a dark yellow, for what its worth. It is no Freedom, which also passed on cholophyll. The color, which is masked by its ability to retain it is an odd combination of primrose and old gold, sometimes with apricot overtones. MM, on the other hand, can accomplish all of this on a plant that is sturdy, hardier, more capable of blooming without intense heat, etc etc etc. Its only con is is thorns. MM also has form that can open pretty much anywhere without issue. St. Patrick, on the other hand, is hgihly selective of how it will behave depending on niche. My thought is to not waste Tom Carruth’s progress on taking a dog of a plant with unusual blooms by going back to scratch when the unusual traits have already been selected for and carried forward.
re: Blackspot. Neither are progressive in this arena. I do not think it matters which is used in regards to blackspot. St Patrick was chosen for its unusual traits and almost passed over because the plant is awful. So disease resistance was a doomed essense to begin with. Its something to consider when choosing mates while using this entire line because I highly doubt either is going to produce favorable disease tolerance if mated to another exhibition HT. Hawkeye Belle, for example, is a good prototype, where cuttable HT blooms have been merged with a plant that will tolerate a lot of things. Like I said, it was a prototype. It too has flaws. Its petals are frail and its plant is overly twiggy, but the model is there for a rose that could have all the wonderful unusual traits of St. Patrick on a plant anyone in Oz would LOVE to have in their garden. Winter Sunset and Honey Sweet are similar archetypes. Your biggest issue is the lack of options, which we know.
I do not know a ton about teas. Ive never lived in a climate that allows them, but I do know that one can induce chlorophyll into them. I have done it to diploid hybid musks, and it retains any yellow pigment for a very, very long time. So that may be something to consider give your constraints. Im going to attach an image of an old hybrid of mine that I culled due to vigor. It is Danae x Pretty Lady. PL can throw chlorophyll, a trait it gets from Freedom. That bloom last one MONTH from that stage to completely open in the middle of August.
Is it possible for you to get Naga Belle there? That would be an excellent stud for a program in Australia.
Nice yellow bud!
I’m not planning on investing more than like 5% of my breeding efforts on St P this season, to give it a scale of importance.
No we can’t get Viraraghavan hybids here yet, to my knowledge.
‘Naga Belle’ is also good for seed.
Jadae,
Would have loved to see the open bloom of your cross. Saw MM at the local Botanical Garden where I volunteer( in the library- on a leave of absence LOL while I try to get the house ready to put up for sale). The bloom is gorgeous but when I saw those thorns…
I don’t know what it is but I love touching and running my hands over my roses and I could do the same thing with my daylilies, etc., but have no interest whatsoever; maybe I like living dangerously!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>I do not know a ton about teas<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Neither do I… I used to visit a heritage rose park/garden near to me, (quite a rarity for this city of mine!!) to just go and relax and get away from other things, and of course to study all these very numerous tea specimens they have there (as well as chinas and quite a few other species, including North American ones).
Anyways, just from observing all of those different types of teas / chinas over time, I can tell you none of them grab me any more, (even though this is quite a sweeping generalization).
Also, if I do go ahead and mate ST P with anything here, it will be somthing like a very healthy floribunda.
As for HT X HT, I would have liked to see how ST P and Elina played out together, but the combination seems a near impossibility, as neither seems to have any real female fertility, (at least on the OP side of things).
thats true: elina will not set seed, op or otherwise, but its pollen will produce some excellent seedlings.
I don’t think anyone could disagree that the huge and bountiful prickers on MM are a con, to say the least. St P has some as well, but nowhere near as bad or as numerous.
Yesterday I got jabbed again by these big rose prickers…it is becoming an “occupational hazard” or sorts… I am more than tempeted to get rid of all my roses which have these huge prickers.
What took you so long, George? Now you have an idea why freedom from prickles became a goal of mine. Elevated triglycerides and cholesterol help to make the blood stickier, so bleeding wasn’t as much of an issue. Bring those levels down, and you bleed like a stuck pig! It isn’t convenient for ventures into the garden to begin resembling slasher movie scenes! LOL! Kim
Tell me about it…I don’t mind the odd prickle, but them big uns are OUT!… it is gonna be the task of the day today, its nice and hot and sunny out here as I right this, a perfect time to head off to them with the shovel, right now!
right = write