Smooth roses

Hello everyone,

I bought a Smooth Velvet rose last year and it was small and did not bloom till late summer when it was very hot and did not set any hips.

Has any one ever had hips on any of the Smooth roses from Harvey Davidson? His roses are hard to find. I could only find one place in the US that sold them, Regan Nursery. But now they do not have any Smooth roses. I think Mr. Davidson is from CA. I would like some more of his roses.


I keep wondering why they’re not more readily available. I’m very happy with Smooth Angel (not my favorite color, but a great rose.)

I think it has to do with the pallete color… it’s not very exciting–pinks to reds. I was really excited with Smooth Buttercup, but I can’t find one. (And even then, I don’t have room for it, but I would have liked to see it readily available none the less…)

Try Smooth Angel. It’s slow to build up, but I think the shapely bloom are beautiful. But, if you want it for hybridizing…

It’s a tough rose. It hardly releases pollen, and sets no hips. I got 3 pollinations from it with Queen Elizabeth. It was a very lucky shot, I think. I never had other luck in the past, so I hope to produce something similar to the Smooth Roses.

If you like thornlessness… look into Pacific Serenade, my favorite mini. Just an incredible shade of pure yellow (but it tends to produce look a likes unless you have one very odd and domineering parent… for example, Basye’s Legacy… I have two Pacific Serenade X Basye’s Legacy that are just odd.)

Ralph Moore has other thornless minis, but I think Paul Barden knows more about that…

The only Smooth rose I tried was Smooth Prince. I do not remember getting any hips.


Are you looking for thornless roses for breeding, or just to grow? There are quite a few good varieties available, from other breeders as well.


The rose, I think, that’s responsible for all the thornlessness in mini’s, and the Smooth series is Captain Thomas.

It’s in the parentage of Little Darling, which figures in a lot of the thornless minis and Davidson’s hybrids.

Plus, if you look at Golden Showers, it has reduced thorns. And Golden Shower seedlings have been thornless such as Red Coat and Dapple Dawn.

I think going back to Captain Thomas would be interesting. I think a cross of Little Darling and Golden Showers could create thornless floribundas.

I have a made a cross of Golden Angels and Pacific Serenade this year, but the hip got lost (it dropped, and I couldn’t find it.) I did this because Paul told me Golden Angel will create thornless roses sometimes. And I thought, hey-- it’s a winning cross.

I am looking for roses for breeding. I have Gina’s rose from Ralph Moore and it will produce hips. Also I have Basyes thornless rose.

I have been growing roses for many years but I have just started trying to breed them.

Pax Apollo doesn’t have thorns.

Daniel, I’ve used Pacific Serenade and it produces thornless roses-- although, it will produce roses with razor sharp needles too. It will produce a lot of look a likes, but if you used something bizarre-- like Basye’s Legacy-- it will produce more interesting looking seedlings. For example, the one I told you that has razor sharp needles-- that’s a cross of Pacific Serenade X Basye’s Legacy.

It’s not so full of those needles, but it’s very disease resistant and has foliage that reminds me of the damasks and portlands.

Tequila, which I just now pruned to be ready for spring growth, has been completely thornless for me for the 3 years that I have had it. It seems to have received this trait from Bonica, I think. So far, though, it has produced thorned seedlings, but looking at my crosses shows that I crossed it with thorned to above-average-thorned male parents…

I am not sure what good this is, yet. But I do think that if thornlessness is an issue, then it would be for landscape roses whose prickles impede weeding and pruning through dense masses of stemlets. So far, though, only the thorniest such as Robusta have made me not want to have a thorny cultivar. In fact, Robusta made me weary because I felt it could cause eye damage had I or anyone else accidently made a false move around such a giant, painful rose…


Take a look at the seedling listed on HMF, link below. This produces seeds (I haven’t tried to germinate them yet) and viable pollen. I expect it may be useful as a breeder for thornlessness. It is extremely vigorous.

Email me if you want more information about it.




I like that rose! I have ‘Sequoia Ruby’. I got it last year before Ralph Moore closed his nursery. They said that is has the ability to produce thornless offspring. The Basyse thornless I have is Blueberry. The email option on the RHA site is turned off it looks like. I would like more information about that rose.