I recall someone was doing work using ‘William Baffin’ as a seed parent years ago, getting the seed to germinate using some leaching techniques (Henry?). Has anyone successfully used WB as a seed parent and obtained seedlings from it? I have some ideas I want to attempt that require making it the seed bearer, but if its not gonna work, I won’t waste my time.
Thanks for any info.
Paul
Paul, early on I got some open pollinated seedlings of William Baffin. Most of my work after that utilized one of those open pollinated seedlings or the pollen of William Baffin.
By using the “Find” command with the name “Baffin” in each of the following links, one can get an idea of what soak conditions I used.
http://home.roadrunner.com/~kuska/germinations-2000.htm
http://home.roadrunner.com/~kuska/2003-2004%20seeds%20germinated.htm
http://home.roadrunner.com/~kuska/winter_2004-2005%20hips.htm
http://home.roadrunner.com/~kuska/Seeds%20Germinated%202006.htm
Last year before I knew that William Baffin was a bad seed parent I wasted a lot of pollen on it. I only found out it was a bad seed parent after I made a lot of crosses on it. I probably pollinated 100 flowers with 20 or so pollen parents. I got five hips out of the effort. One from Gene Boener and Playboy. The last two was both from L83. All together I got 7 seeds. All the pollen I used was probably tetraploid. The seed still has not germinated. I will give the L83 and the playboy crosses a couple years to germinate because I like the cross. But just out of the work alone to get a few things to set I would steer in a different direction.
Paul B,
In 2007 I tried WB as the seed parent with two different pollens (Chuckles and Fuchsia Meidiland). None of the WB x Chuckles took and only 3 hips with Fuchsia Meidiland formed. I got 4 seeds and none of those germinated. I also collected some OP seeds that year and I was able to get a few seeds to germinate. If you really want to use WB as the seed parent, I would recommend pollinating a lot of flowers in hopes of getting some seeds and then you may have to do embryo rescue on those seeds to get any seedlings from them. WB has been a much better pollen parent. Most of its offspring have been very healthy, but they will take three seasons to bloom, though I had a couple that bloomed last year as seedlings. Here are pictures from this year of the two that bloomed last year.
Paul G
Link: s171.photobucket.com/albums/u288/ptgeurts/?action=view¤t=MyHeroxWilliamBaffin.jpg
Thanks for that info. I won’t waste my time trying to work it as the seed parent. I have used its pollen many times but this one cross I wanted is only possible if I use it for seed, but I won’t bother. Oh well!
Why not do an embryo extraction?
Or send it to Don for embryo rescue.
oops… didn’t see Paul Geurts already suggested that… my bad… is a good idea though…
Is John Cabot any better? I dont see any further generations from it but the lineage is similar and it seems like a superior plant.
I’ve had similar results with William Baffin and John Cabot accepting pollen, but I think that Mike Lowe released a few where William Baffin was the seed parent. WB definitely sets OP hips, John Cabot too.
Liz
Things are a bit disorganized at the moment because we’re moving but my records say I have about a dozen seedlings from about 75 seeds of Henry’s #193 which I think is Hamborger Phoenix X William Baffin. As I recall the seeds were in fairly ragged condition when they got here, having been stored for some time and maybe even stratified.
IMHO it’s the long shots are most worth the effort of culturing the embryos. I’m happy to try to help even the odds.
My John Cabot does not set hips at all here.
My John Cabot very, very rarely sets an open pollinated hip.
“I think that Mike Lowe released a few where William Baffin was the seed parent”
Mike’s seedlings all involved ‘William Baffin’ as the pollen parent, if I’m not mistaken.
NH Statehouse is one that used WB as a seed parent with Prairie Princess as the pollen parent, at least according to HMF. Too bad that HMF does not have photo of it.
My John Cabot sets small hips with just a few seeds, but there are lots of them. The pollen works fine on floribundas. Some offspring will be just as big & floriforous as JC. My best seedling from such a cross will set the occasional op hip but rejects deliberate crosses.
Paul, Liz
I did a lot of pollinating with and for Mike for quite a few years and I don’t recall Mike ever successfully using William Baffin as a seed parent. He used William Baffin pollen extensively. The HMF listing for NH State House is incorrect.
Personally I never did like the results from William Baffin or John Cabot. My preferences to instill hardiness and vigor has been to use John Davis as the pollen parent. I have gotten many hardy and vigorous repeat bloomera from JD over the years. Many are pastels, yellow blends, orange blends, apricots and pure yellows. JD will frequently produce stippling. Frontenac also is useful as a pollen parent but offspring not as vigorous as JDs.
Many of the JD F1 offspring are just as difficult as JD to use as the seed parent. However I do have several F1s that are very willing to set hips and produce viable seed.
If you want to use William Baffin you might consider using an F1 that shows the traits your looking for and one that will set hips.
Im going to try to do Summer Wind x John Cabot. Thanks for the warning that JC isnt exactly the best seed parent. I’m gonna mix the JC pollen with Napa Valley and Electric Blanket to see what comes up from this mix. Hopefully, Summer Wind can produce a seedling from JC that tones down the color harshness and want to climb while retaining the awesome foliage, hardiness and good repeat.
Colour harshness??? I thought you were into eye-bleed colours 
Yeah, the neon ones lol. I never said I had demure taste 
