Crepuscule ploidy

Is Crepuscule a diploid?

It is diploid. I have heard however as a pollen parent it does work on almost everything. Apparently it is very fertile as a pollen parent. This is one of those plants I wonder why more work has not been done with it. I have never worked with it and I doubt it would survive my climate but it seems like it could be special and when I seen it in Virgina it was amazing.

I’m working with it… one reason more isn’t done with it may be its tendency to produce very large climbers. Good for me… not much good at stimulating interest in roses.


I have used it occasionally (and will again in 2011) and found it sets seed on most anything (especially other diploids, and I’m not certain that it IS a diploid, but the assumption has been made.) and it can produce some beautiful seedlings. 0-47-19 X Crepuscule gave me several outstanding seedlings, including one I donated to the SJHRG for fund-raising. (Now listed as Mel’s Heritage: look it up on HMF) People at the SJHRG refer to it in comparison to Climbing Cecile Brunner (but more lax growth) but being far more generous with bloom. It also happens to be one of the most disease free roses I have ever bred.

I also have a very pretty seedling thats been hanging around in the greenhouse since 2003: 19-02-03, from a cross of 'Joycie X Crepuscule. See link below.

Some crosses will yield a lot of mildew prone seedlings, but some crosses won’t mildew at all. It is very capable of bringing decent yellow/orange coloring to its progeny. I highly encourage folks to work with it. Whether or not you get climbers depends largely on what you mate it with; 19-02-03 rarely exceeds 20 inches!



Yes, very fertile as pollen parent. I used to play with it a bit. I also produced a number of Joyce x Crepescule seedlings. All mildewed so badly I tossed them while young.

‘Crepescule’ itself mildews badly here every season.

It could be the mildew is a function of soil moisture and drying winds.

My specimen is watered daily like clockwork but the soil is very sandy. I suspect the roots can’t compensate for water loss quickly enough.

Whatever the reason it’s kept me from pursuing it further.

Yeah, mildew was my first though re: Crepscule but I also considered that it might be another viable line of breeding of the noisette/musk/multiflora/tea types. Trier is pretty great but its good to diversify. It also seems to be a decent source of tea-yellow/bronze. Its definitely not my desired class to work with but I can see how it could be especially beneficial for Oz.

I’d love to see a diploid line of minis some day that brings together the best of wichurana, chinensis minima, tea/noisette and anything else that could possibly add to health and charm. I am sure there are a lot of possible species out there that may mix well.


Your ‘19-02-03’ has great color and form. Very nice.

My ‘Crepuscule’ hasn’t mildewed at all for me here and grows very slowly. It flowers well into winter here and is evergreen. All seedlings from it here have been ditched so far. I was thinking I might try to bring it together with the non-climbing OP 0-47-19 seedling I have as well as the remontant 0-47-19 seedling. I’ve bought ‘Knockout’ this year and it seems ok so far and was thinking it might be good with ‘Crepuscule’ and ‘Sympathie’ has just arrived that might work with it :slight_smile: ‘Softee’ and ‘Renee’ are on my list to get together with it and I was just thinking ‘Popcorn’ might work with it too… so many things to try :slight_smile:

Oh well…

Looks like no-one really knows the ploidy of Crepuscule for sure, which is what I suspected. It would be great to have it confirmed some day, to be sure!

BTW…Adam, where have you gotten the info that it is diploid…is this confirmed?

Had to review the notes I took on it. I took the information before I began to write down sources for my notes. But I think it was a spread sheet I found on the internet somewhere that I have been unable to find again. I did put a question mark by the ploidy in my notes telling me I was not sure on the source. But almost all of the ones I put question marks by; the question marks have disappeared. So I do think this spread sheet was right. So I am not totally certain. If I had to guess the ploidy I think I would say however that it was either diploid or triploid.