I’ll fill in the lineage so you can view it Simon.
I guess it should come as no surprise it’s single considering Playboy, Altissimo, Lilac Charm and Muriel are in it’s lineage. I’m hoping others will be more double.
Link: www.helpmefind.com/rose/pl.php?n=78289&tab=21&lstTyp=16
Thanks Robert 
I’d love to get some of Mr Moore’s miniature hybrid bracteata to play with… even considered making my own as we can’t get ‘Out of Yesterday’ or ‘Muriel’ here (that I’ve found yet). I’ll be interested to see what happens with these ‘Altissimo’ seeds then.
Simon, the Moore bracteatas are far from perfect but they are hopefully a means to an end. They are fascinating.
Simon,
I can at least send you pollen of several interesting Bracteata hybrids in a few weeks time, although I’m not sure that will help you this season. I have all of the Moore Bracteatas here, plus several of my own with better coloring than most of the Moore varieties.
By the way, here is one of my first ‘Hot Cocoa’ (aka ‘Hot Chocolate’) seedlings. (see URL) Make sure you look at the photos I posted.
Paul
Can you legally send pollen to Australia??? I’ve looked at that seedling before and love its intense colour… I was looking at it when I was looking at what has come out of ‘Altissimo’ when I noticed how easy ‘Altissimo’ set hips and how big they were.
It looks like the key step in developing the bracteata hybrids was the appearance of ‘Muriel’ and it looks like ‘Muriel’ was made by crossing an HT with bracteata… so I was thinking of doing something similar (only I was going to use 'Ebb Tide’to kick me off instead). Then 'Out of Yesteryear’was made by putting ‘Muriel’ with ‘Sequoia Gold’ so I was thinking of using one of my better minis here to do the same thing (I was thinking of 'Rise n Shine’but want stronger colours than it seems to produce so was thinking of one of my own red mini seedings once I assess their fertility) and from there it seems like I’ll nearly be at the same point as the mini bracteata hybrids (don’t say anything 
ignorance is bliss!).
“Can you legally send pollen to Australia???”
I think you can legally mail pollen anywhere you like. If I’m wrong, I hope someone will speak up and advise me.
Paul
According to AQIS (Australian quarantine), pollen is classified as a ‘quarantine risk material’ and therefore needs to be accompanied by permits of entry. I would not like to get anyone in trouble but very much appreicate the offer.
Oops. Fair enough. Thanks for that info.
Yeah… bummer… s’ok… I am going to enjoy playing with bracteata over the next few seasons
Update on this… I could not get a single seed from Altissimo to germinate. I’d managed to get OP hips to germinate the previous season but none of the planned crosses germinated. For this reason I have not used it this season with anything except ‘Euphrates’, which has taken as well. It’s a great seed setter with just about everything. Am looking for tips on how to get BIG difficult seeds to germinate without digging the embryos out.
Simon,
I would suggest you try letting the seeds go moldy during stratification. Yes, you heard right! I believe the white mold that often forms in my storage bags while in the fridge breaks down the seed coat as it digests organic matter on the outside of the achene. I think the mold is a natural part of the process of removal of germination inhibitors in the achene. For other rose species in their natural environment an animal’s digestive tract does the same job, but cleaning moldy seeds is far more appealing to me than, well…you know!
How many hips are there Simon?
Yeah… I believe this too Paul… and I don’t usually clean mould off the seeds… I’m pretty hands-off during stratification. I stratified them in paper towel, not perlite (which inhibits most the moulds that form in the fridge… I believe by mechanical/abbrassive means) and pretty much just left them, checking them every now and then (as per my previous post in the poor germination thread). I was going to use peat this season instead of paper towel hoping that more of these decomposing-type microbes might be present to assist the break-down of the achene. It would be really good to know the composition of the ‘glue’ that joins the two halves of the achene together to see if there is something you could bath the achenes in to ‘digest’ this material (Don did tell me and I will have to go back through old emails to remind me what it was… Don… did you ever try the bromelain?). There’s only one hip this season, however, given that this cross actually took with just a single pollination and Jim suggested that if I am going to use ‘Euphrates’ I need to find the most fertile remontant bridge variety as the seed parent so next season I should do many more to maximise my chances. I was only thinking last night that maybe ‘Altissimo’ is such a stupid cross with ‘Euphrates’ when I was looking at teh pedigrees of Mr Moore’s hulthemia hybrids on HMF and noticed the bridge variety (on ‘Tigris’; also an F1 persica hybrid) was ‘Playboy’ which to me, is a very similar rose to ‘Altissimo’… in fact ‘Altissimo’ has been put with ‘Playboy’ to make such roses as ‘Hot Chocolate’ so the two are obviously compatible together.
So I was wondering what others do when they have big seeds that are particulrly difficult to germinate. I have confirmed that when the embryos are extracted they were viable in the OP seeds but haven’t extracted any embryos from the planned crosses. ‘Altissimo’ makes enormous hips but there are surprisingly few seeds in them. The I’ve ever got out of them is about 12. I’m not good enough at the embryo extraction method yet to risk the planned, more valuable, crosses at this stage. The ‘Altissimo’ achenes are very thick and woody and the embryo surprisingly small… the extraction was quite difficult with these though they were very viable and grew easily from that point on. Would leaving them in the fridge for longer improve the chances of germination? Would a bromelain bath, or some other enzyme based bath, help? Henry was doing some work with red light wasn’t he? Must go and read up on that too…
Can you buy cellulases? I think Don said the material ‘gluing’ the two halves of the achene together is cellulose based… maybe a cellulase could help break it down…
Simon, see:
http://home.roadrunner.com/~kuska/improvementrosegermination.htm
Link: home.roadrunner.com/~kuska/improvementrosegermination.htm
Simon, I haven’t done any more work with enzymes yet. My feeling is that suberinase in combination with cellulase are what’s needed to dissolve sutures. Suberinase is not commercially available. Dr. Kuska’s results are the best empirical evidence I’ve seen that bromelain works and it seems to be the best enzymatic option at this point.
I did try straight sodium hydroxide in fairly high concentrations, with and without isopropanol. This didn’t dent fresh achenes even over weeks of soaking.
You can buy a ton of various enzymes are places like Vitamin Shoppe. I am sure everyone’s locale has something similar. Also, you can buy enzymes for cheap online. There is a huge range of enzymes available. Amylase, Xylanase, Cellulase and Ligninase would probably be the best suited for the job of breaking down a seed coat. However, I would be sure to thoroughly wash away any enzymes before germination because they could possibly be a detriment to the plant itself since they all break down cell walls of various plant materials. I know that Amylase can be bought at such stores. The others would probably have to be bought online. I have been told oxi-clean works, too, but I wont allow that crap in my home. It is potent and screws up quality clothing if left on too long (ie. an unknown spill = good bye $40 pants). Also, I like the idea of enzymes over unknown chemicals that have not been tested for enough comfortable years because of unknown health risks.
Amylase is made in your own saliva and is used for decomposing starch… nice easy cheap source
I have no idea about the efficacy of amylase alone for this job, however note that your saliva contains this enzyme, so supply is readily available and cheap (at least for those who have functioning salivary glands)…LOL.
LOL…Simon, you and I are getting dangerously alike in our thinking!